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When were the two holes started on the receiver for a micrometer sight on the 1894? Were the tang sight holes on the tang eliminated at the same time? Was it earlier for other models? Many 1886s and 71s in the Winchester book are shown with holes and sights, but Madis does not discuss it in the pictures.
Winchester eliminated the tang sight mounting hole in late June, 1942 on the Model 94 & 64. They began drilling & tapping the Model 94 receiver holes in late 1952, circa serial number 1916000. Oddly enough, the drilled & tapped receiver sight holes were standard on the Model 64 beginning in August 1933. It was never a “standard” feature for the Model 1886, and for the Model 71, it was a common special order feature from inception of the model in 1935 until it became standard in late 1946.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Bert H. said
They began drilling & tapping the Model 94 receiver holes in late 1952, circa serial number 1916000. Oddly enough, the drilled & tapped receiver sight holes were standard on the Model 64 beginning in August 1933.
Bert
Just wondering about how the late ’52 date is derived? I only ask because Renneberg puts the date in the 1790000 serial number range, which would be about a year earlier. I’m contemplating a purchase of a Model 94 in 25-35 that has the two tapped holes with a SN of 1798252 and learning is half the fun…Is there a definitive reference to have and to hold?
Regards, Ron
Technically, the glass is always full; half liquid, half air....
WACA #10293
rwsem said
Just wondering about how the late ’52 date is derived? I only ask because Renneberg puts the date in the 1790000 serial number range, which would be about a year earlier. I’m contemplating a purchase of a Model 94 in 25-35 that has the two tapped holes with a SN of 1798252 and learning is half the fun…Is there a definitive reference to have and to hold?
Regards, Ron
Ron,
Bob did not get that piece of information correct, and has since recanted it. The Model 94 research survey I have been working on since late 2005 definitely shows when Winchester began drilling & tapping the Model 94 as a standard feature. I routinely share a copy of the survey with Bob Renneberg, and he has used it to update and correct some of the information in his book. He is a semi frequent visitor here on the WACA forum, and you can send him a PM with this question if you still doubt my research.
With that stated, it is entirely possible that serial number 1798252 was special ordered with the D&T receiver sight holes. However, I would first carefully inspect the holes. Winchester completed all milling operations before bluing the receiver frame. If the holes are in the white, you have your answer… aftermarket work. Further, the entrance to the holes is another thing to inspect. The vast majority of gun smiths were/are not able to duplicate the precision machine work that Winchester accomplished. Often, the edges of the holes are a bit ragged or sharp, or slightly puckered, etc. on an aftermarket D&T receiver. Winchester’s work was flawless.
As a point of interest, is the caliber marking “25-35 W.C.F.”, or is it “25-35 WIN.” ?
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Thanks for the information Bert- I don’t doubt the research. I was just wanting to learn more. I’ll have to ask for pictures and convince them to take the receiver sight off to check the holes. It was listed as 25-35 WIN but I’ll ask for clarification. Since this Covid mess started, this gun shop stopped posting photos, so I need to get friendly with an associate over the phone or by email… More to follow. Regards, Ron
Technically, the glass is always full; half liquid, half air....
WACA #10293
Bert H. said
As a point of interest, is the caliber marking “25-35 W.C.F.”, or is it “25-35 WIN.” ?Bert
Bert, to finish this out, it is marked 25-35 WIN. Also, the receiver is D&T after leaving the factory- threads are white.
Technically, the glass is always full; half liquid, half air....
WACA #10293
Bert is correct although there are many examples found D&T in earlier serial ranges. His method of determination of originality by inspecting the screw holes themselves is very good, however, finding, checking and recording such originality findings would be indeed a daunting task. His research shows clearly the time of actual predominance of the holes and is therefore quite accurate.
Cheers,
B
Also you can consider the random/accidental use of a Model 64 receiver in Model 94 assembly which even in earlier serial ranges would have factory D&T holes — mistakes happen.
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