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Does the lightweight and extra light mean the same on the model of 1886? I have one from 1901 that blue-book describes as lightweight but the Cody museum letter uses the term extra light. Also on the lightweight or extra light models are they all blued including hammer and lever I seem to find info that says yes and no? My rifles configuration is 45-70 with a 22 inch round barrel, button mag shotgun butt and Lyman front hunting sight. Any info would be great. Thanks!
Kash,
Winchester never used the term “lightweight” for their Model 1886. They only catalogued the Extra Light Weight. The pre-1902 Extra Light Weight rifles should have case color finished levers and hammers.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
There was an excellent Model 1886 display at Cody two years ago. The owner of the display had Cody letters for each rifle if they were available, and went as far as to have a booklet printed with photos of the rifles next to the factory letters. I believe at least two listed “light weight” rather than “extra light” (sorry if the terms are not exactly verbatim). I think we had some discussion as to whether this was actually a listed configuration or was used as an adjective, but “light weight” without the “extra” was in the letters at least. I took special interest in this since the subject comes up every once and awhile. Maybe someone with the John Madl book would also have some information also? Like Bert is saying, I don’t think it was configuration that was in the catalogs specifically, but if the term is found in the records it could be partially responsible for the it being used by Model 1886 collectors. I have the booklet that was available to the judges to take, but I let another collector borrow it and if I get it back I’ll scan the letters. Bert may have a copy also.
Folks,
I have my copy of the handout that Brad refers to in the above. Indeed there are two factory letters that refer to the weights as “Light weight”. The rest either refer to the rifles as “extra light weight” or do not state the weight at all. The first rifle so referred is a 40/82 with 24 inch, round barrel, plain trigger, 1/2 magazine, shotgun butt rubber, light weight, then addresses sights. Received in warehouse Dec 17, 1895, so it is not a late use of the term.
Second rifle is a 50/100, 24 inch round barrel, set trigger, Lyman rear sight, taken from returned gun , 1/2 magazine, shotgun butt, rubber butt plate, light weight, received in warehouse Apr 11, 1896.
Those rifles with the “extra light” designation were received in the warehouse on Apr 25, 1898; Apr 25, 1898; Jan 21, 1905; Nov 10, 1897; Jan 23, 1907; Oct 18, 1902; Sep 30, 1902;Mar 22, 1905; Jul 29, 1904;Jun 15, 1905; Oct 1, 1900; Mar 20,1895; Sep 8, 1896; Nov 9, 1908; Oct 25, 1900. Folks interpreting and signing the letters vary from across the boards over some period of time. The letters with the “light weight” designation were signed by folks who also had signed letters stating “extra light weight”. Thus it appears to NOT be a researcher’s foible as to the term used.
I would have to conclude that whomever entered the data in the factory ledger may have had some confusion of terms, which thus tends to confuse us. It is rather obvious the prevailing term is “extra light weight” however.
I just love throwing gasoline on the fire!
Tim Tomlinson
Hey Tim
Isn’t that a neat little book? Thanks for having your copy handy with that information.
Brad
One more question on the 1886, are button mags rare or normal on the extra light models? This 1886 has one.
Thanks
Kash
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