Log In
Members
Home
Add Reply
Add Topic
Offline
Some time ago I downloaded from a forum, a letter written in September 2010 by Herbert Houze, which detailed some orders from the U.S. Government and some States to Winchester in WW2. My main interest is in British military small arms including those supplied by the U.S.A to Great Britain in both World Wars, but I am sure the following will be of interest to those that collect U.S. military small arms.
State of Maine: January 23rd 1942 X50 @ $24.06 each. .30WCF 20 inch barrel.
Kansas Ordnance Depot: January 5th 1942 X8 @ $24.06 each.
U.S. Department of the Interior: January 20th 1942 X65 @ $24.06
U.S. Department of Justice: January 26 1942 X16 @ $24.06.
Defense Plant Corporation, Las Vegas, Nevada: March 16th 1942 X100 @ $24.06
State of Minnesota: April 10th 1942: X200 @ 24.06
U.S. Bureau of Reclamation: April 24th 1942 X2 @ 24.56.
U.S. Bureau of Government Requirements: April 18th 1942 X12,000 @ $23.50 and X3,000 $23.50 being G94423C .32 Winchester 20 inch barrel.
Total 15,441.
Mr Houze goes on to say that a total of 27,639 Model 94 carbines were supplied to the Allies, the way the letter is written it implies that the 15,441 U.S. guns are included in this total, but this may not be the case.
This information is taken from the McCracken Research Archive MS 20 2/52. Although I spent four days in the McCracken Library a few years ago I dont think I read this file.
Is anyone visiting Cody soon who could access this file, I would like to know if there is a breakdown of the non U.S. Government orders supplied to the Allies in WW2. Thanks.
Regards
AlanD
Sydney
Alan,
I would very much appreciate getting a copy of that letter from you.
Thanks,
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
E-mail on the way!
Last night I got onto the index of records for Winchester held in the McCracken Library and the Series 2 Box 52 does not exist. Series 2 being World War 2, which undoubtedly is where this info is stored. Its a bit of a puzzle.
I am keen to see the distribution of the 12,198 Model 94’s that when to the Allies. I know that the Netherlands Purchasing Commission purchased some for use in the Dutch East Indies, but these were purchased from distributors rather than from the factory, as far as I know.
Regards
Alan
Alan,
For the benefit of everyone who may be following this topic, the only confirmed Model 94 30 WCF Carbines I have found (records in my research survey) that are tied to WW II use are the 2,500 that were sold to the Canadian government for issue to the British Columbia PCMR. Thus far, I have survey (508) PCMR Winchesters. I have not found a single Model 94 that was manufactured in 1942 (or anytime during WW II for that matter) that has “U S” markings on it.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
New member here. I apologize if this is the wrong place for this information. The topic caught my attention. Recently, I purchased a Winchester 94 Carbine manufactured in 1941 from a local estate sale. The man told me it belonged to his father who was a Major in the U.S. Army. He was in the Transportation Core stationed at the Pentagon from 1941 to 1945. These rifles were in racks in the Pentagon and available for the officers to check out if they wanted to go deer hunting in nearby Maryland. On the butt of the stock is a small brass plate with “USAAF” (U.S. Army Air Force) on it and additional information I do not know the meaning of, as I have not been in the military. I have pics if anyone is interested. I am also trying to figure out exactly what the other information on the plate means. It shoots very well with a very good bore. Outside is clean, maybe 80% condition. Serial #1283998.
[email protected] said
New member here. I apologize if this is the wrong place for this information. The topic caught my attention. Recently, I purchased a Winchester 94 Carbine manufactured in 1941 from a local estate sale. The man told me it belonged to his father who was a Major in the U.S. Army. He was in the Transportation Core stationed at the Pentagon from 1941 to 1945. These rifles were in racks in the Pentagon and available for the officers to check out if they wanted to go deer hunting in nearby Maryland. On the butt of the stock is a small brass plate with “USAAF” (U.S. Army Air Force) on it and additional information I do not know the meaning of, as I have not been in the military. I have pics if anyone is interested. I am also trying to figure out exactly what the other information on the plate means. It shoots very well with a very good bore. Outside is clean, maybe 80% condition. Serial #1283998.
The serial number identifies it as a June, 1941 production Carbine. You did not mention which caliber it is (e.g. 30 WCF or 32 WS). Please send the pictures of the brass plate & markings to me at [email protected]
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
I know that the Defense Supplies Corporation basically controlled the distribution of non military handguns during WWII. I believe all or virtually all nonmilitary handguns went to federal state or local agencies and defense industry plant guards. I am wondering if anyone know did they also control the distributions of long guns during WWII.
Can it be assumed that all of the 29882 Model 94 carbine produced in 1942 went to fulfil critical needs of the war effort? ie federal, state or local agencies or defense industry guards or were some sold to distributer or mom and pop hardware stores.
Late 1941 produced Texas Dept. of Public Safety M94 carbine
For anyone interested who has not found these yet, the following handwritten factory “Quotations and Orders” ledgers for WWII are available as downloadable digital scanned files from the McCracken library:
Folder MS20.07.17: Index of Quotations Submitted & Orders Received, 1942
Folder MS20.07.18: Index of Quotations Submitted & Orders Received, 1943
Folder MS29.07.19: Index of Quotations Submitted & Orders Received, 1944
Folder MS20.07.20: Index of Quotations Submitted & Orders Received, 1945
This cover all transactions between Winchester and US/State Government agencies for the stated year. Everything from guns and ammunition to flashlight batteries and lubricants. They are accessible via this URL:
http://centerofthewest.libraryhost.com/?p=collections/findingaid&id=21&q=&rootcontentid=9160#id9160
There are related documents pertaining to US and Allied Contracts during WW I (although it does not appear that all possibly relevant documents have been scanned as yet) at:
http://centerofthewest.libraryhost.com/?p=collections/findingaid&id=21&q=&rootcontentid=9159#id9159
Good Luck!!! 
WACA 9519; Studying Pre-64 Model 70 Winchesters
Colt1860 said
Can it be assumed that all of the 29882 Model 94 carbine produced in 1942 went to fulfil critical needs of the war effort? ie federal, state or local agencies or defense industry guards or were some sold to distributer or mom and pop hardware stores.
Definitely not. I have surveyed 800+ Model 94 Carbines manufactured between January 1st, 1942 through August 23rd, 1942 (when Winchester temporarily ceased production for the remainder of WW II) that are civilian (privately) owned firearms.
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Colt1860 said
I know that the Defense Supplies Corporation basically controlled the distribution of non military handguns during WWII. I believe all or virtually all nonmilitary handguns went to federal state or local agencies and defense industry plant guards. I am wondering if anyone know did they also control the distributions of long guns during WWII.Can it be assumed that all of the 29882 Model 94 carbine produced in 1942 went to fulfil critical needs of the war effort? ie federal, state or local agencies or defense industry guards or were some sold to distributer or mom and pop hardware stores.
Late 1941 produced Texas Dept. of Public Safety M94 carbine
During the later part of 1942 when the U.S. small arms industry was mobilized exclusive for war time production, various regulations were introduced concerning the sale of handguns, as you mention. This also applied to long guns. The regulations covered calibers for rifles with .30/06 and .30/30 being singled out. With shotguns the regulations concerned 12 & 16 gauge, also the type of shotgun, auto, pump and so on. I do remember that some guns were not included in the list of guns that could not be sold if they had a very high retail price like an embellished Fox shotgun or whatever the case may be.
The best source for reading up on this interesting area are the big retail/mail order catalogues put out by Stoeger and similar company’s.
Its not really me area and I only looked into it for any implications that may have affected British purchases of small arms in America for clandestine purposes.
Regards
AlanD
1 Guest(s)
