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Erin Grivicich said
Okay, I will confess….. 12/31/2020 is my last day of employment and I will officially become an R.O.F……… Now if they will only open up the gun shows here so I can get “back to work”
!
Good for you! I am jealous, as I have 3-years to go (my last day is planned to be 12/31/2023), and I plan to travel to several of the larger shows in the eastern half of the country.
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Bert H. said
Chuck,
I do not know about Erin, but you are a R.O.F. and have plenty of time for “projects”. Those of us who have yet attained R.O.F. status are limited on the number of projects we can take on.
Bert – Not yet a R.O.F. but working on it…
Depending on which company. Retired from 4. Last one was 9/2010. Time is not my problem. Old age is.
clarence said
Chuck said Loading data for this round is nowhere to be found. The only die maker is CH4D.
Pre-war Ideal Handbooks have it, list 3.4 g Unique, so you were close. Other powders are listed, but they’re obsolete. For less money than CH4D charges, pretty sure you can buy an Ideal tong tool, or Lyman 310 tool, on ebay. Not going to find one overnight, but if the alternative is waiting 18 months, I’d start looking.
Clarence, are these Ideal Handbooks numbered? My 1951 is #38.
Chuck said
Clarence, are these Ideal Handbooks numbered? My 1951 is #38.
Sure, they’re all numbered. And your 38 should have complete info on the 310 tools.
The one containing the 22WCF load was #27, undated but from the ’20s I think.
clarence said
Sure, they’re all numbered. And your 38 should have complete info on the 310 tools.
The one containing the 22WCF load was #27, undated but from the ’20s I think.
Thanks. All of the manuals are available from Cornell Publishing for about $15. The 1906 catalog #17 says it has loading data for Winchester and other manufacturers. #27 does not list that it has loading data. It is from 1926. Cornell lists a Contents page for each catalog.
Chuck said
#27 does not list that it has loading data. It is from 1926.
They ALL contain load data–that’s why almost all reloaders used them.
A sleazy color-copy reprint for $15 or a nice original for $30? No comparison, I promise you. I’d buy this myself if I didn’t have several others from the same period.
clarence said
Chuck said
#27 does not list that it has loading data. It is from 1926.
They ALL contain load data–that’s why almost all reloaders used them.
A sleazy color-copy reprint for $15 or a nice original for $30? No comparison, I promise you. I’d buy this myself if I didn’t have several others from the same period.
My problem is I want one that definitely has the data for the 22WCF. I know by 1951 #38 it is not there. If you are positive that #27 has it I will look for one of those.
On another subject. Is there a general rule that states at what FPS you should use gas checks when shooting cast bullets? Or one by powder?
Chuck said
My problem is I want one that definitely has the data for the 22WCF. I know by 1951 #38 it is not there. If you are positive that #27 has it I will look for one of those.
On another subject. Is there a general rule that states at what FPS you should use gas checks when shooting cast bullets? Or one by powder?
Don’t have to buy 27 (though it’s worth having), I can tell you: 3.4 Unique, 13 FFG, plus 3 others that are obsolete smokeless. All for 45g bullets.
Above 1600 fps for gas checks, though the lead alloy has some bearing also.
clarence said
Chuck said
My problem is I want one that definitely has the data for the 22WCF. I know by 1951 #38 it is not there. If you are positive that #27 has it I will look for one of those.
On another subject. Is there a general rule that states at what FPS you should use gas checks when shooting cast bullets? Or one by powder?
Don’t have to buy 27 (though it’s worth having), I can tell you: 3.4 Unique, 13 FFG, plus 3 others that are obsolete smokeless. All for 45g bullets.
Above 1600 fps for gas checks, though the lead alloy has some bearing also.
Thanks Clarence on both accounts. Does this catalog have any data for the 1876 cartridges other than black powder. Barnes is the only one that gives some data but not much.
Chuck,
Might be worth investing in Mike Venturino’s book, “shooting lever guns of the old west” It’s relatively inexpensive and he has loading data listed for lots of the old obsolete cartridges. If I recall correctly, he lists black powder and smokeless equivalents. Another good one to keep around is a version of “cartridges of the world” There is a limited amount of loading data available in it. If you can find a copy from the 70’s-early eighty’s I believe they have a bit more data than the newer versions, again, relatively inexpensive.
keywords=mike+venturino+Shooting+lever+guns+of+the+old+west&qid=1608580157&sr=8-1
Erin
Erin Grivicich said
If you can find a copy from the 70’s-early eighty’s I believe they have a bit more data than the newer versions, again, relatively inexpensive.
Mine is ’72–the paper, cheap to begin with, is now yellow as old newspaper, & equally brittle; but it’s going to outlast me.
Problem using the old Ideal manuals is that aside from Bullseye & Unique, most of the other smokeless powders listed have been discontinued for 75 or more yrs. However, for many of the large BP cartridges, a fast burning powder like Unique is still the best choice. In a small one like 22WCF, I wouldn’t be afraid to try Bullseye in an amount recommended for a small pistol cartridge like .32 S&W.
Erin Grivicich said
Chuck,Might be worth investing in Mike Venturino’s book, “shooting lever guns of the old west” It’s relatively inexpensive and he has loading data listed for lots of the old obsolete cartridges. If I recall correctly, he lists black powder and smokeless equivalents. Another good one to keep around is a version of “cartridges of the world” There is a limited amount of loading data available in it. If you can find a copy from the 70’s-early eighty’s I believe they have a bit more data than the newer versions, again, relatively inexpensive.
keywords=mike+venturino+Shooting+lever+guns+of+the+old+west&qid=1608580157&sr=8-1
Erin
Thanks Erin. I have both books. Mike’s book is falling apart, terrible attempt at binding, but has good data for some of the common calibers. No 76 data. Cartridges of the World has much more data and is authored by Frank Barnes. Barnes’ data has been used by other authors for years.
I duplicate the original 22 wfc ballistics in the 22 hornet using our 50gn plain base bullet at .225″ diameter and BHN-15. We sell the original 46gn Winchester .228″ diameter bullets for the 22 wcf. My load in the hornet uses 2.9gn Accurate Arms #2 with a CCI # 550 spm primer for a velocity of 1550 fps The same load in the 22 wcf with slightly larger bore diameter and 4gn lighter bullet weight should serve well in the 22 wcf though will likely produce slightly lower velocity. I usually set a limit of 1500 fps for plain base bullets without gas checks but this load in the hornet case shoots good at 1550 fps. The 22 wcf should produce around 1500 fps so all should be well.
I forgot to mention that the 22 hornet I used for developing this load is a depression era conversion on an 1898 Krag. It is converted to single shot only. Very interesting rifle with a hand made double set trigger. It has a 24″ barrel with a 1/16″ twist.
The Bullshop said
I duplicate the original 22 wfc ballistics in the 22 hornet using our 50gn plain base bullet at .225″ diameter and BHN-15. We sell the original 46gn Winchester .228″ diameter bullets for the 22 wcf. My load in the hornet uses 2.9gn Accurate Arms #2 with a CCI # 550 spm primer for a velocity of 1550 fps The same load in the 22 wcf with slightly larger bore diameter and 4gn lighter bullet weight should serve well in the 22 wcf though will likely produce slightly lower velocity. I usually set a limit of 1500 fps for plain base bullets without gas checks but this load in the hornet case shoots good at 1550 fps. The 22 wcf should produce around 1500 fps so all should be well.
Can you post a link for your 46 grn. .228 bullets, there may be some interest from a few folks on this forum.
Thanks!
Erin
It’s not my intention to hijack this thread, but if anyone is interested, I have for sale an original boxed set of Winchester reloading implements model 1882, in .22 WCF.
With all of this talk and sales of loading tools it might just tempt me. I only have about 3 sets. If I bought a set for each caliber I have I could pay for another gun.
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