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Local shop has a new 1886 45-90. It has warning on barrel “black powder only”. Is the 45-90 version that weak that it can’t shoot smokeless?
November 7, 2015
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There are no SAAMI specs for the 45-90 and you can’t load the 45-90 case to dangerous levels using BP. In my opinion the 45-90 is a poor choice for smokeless powder, it’s a blackpowder cartridge. It is very possible to load smokeless powder to a dangerous level in that cavernous 45-90 case. The gun’s manufacturer can’t be responsible for what ammo may be manufactured for that chambering so they specify something that they know will be safe. As far as manufacturers are concerned if you want to use smokeless in their 45-90 you’re on your own. That’s pretty much the same as any handloading proposition so it’s no big deal to the knowledgeable and conscientious handloader.
Mike
January 20, 2023
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I have about the same gun you’re looking at with the same sticker. The sticker is a creation of Fabrique Nationale de Armes de Guerre’s legal department, populated by adults still afraid of the dark.
As Mike says, 45-90 was never SAAMI qualified because it became obsolete before SAAMI existed.
If you read the tedious little Limited Warranty cards that come in the current Winchester boxes with ALL their excellent guns, you will see you are SOL.if your modest handload detonates and blows fingers off.
ECOUTE MOI! You are to shoot FACTORY STANDARD PRESSURE AMMUNITION only,
MON DIEU! But there is no FACTORY 45-90 ammunition, nor is there any 45-90 STANDARD PRESSURE. What to do?.
Warrant the use of black powder ONLY because the morons can’t get enough into the case to blow the gun up. VOILA!
The barrels of the new Winchester Model 1886 rifles are made from the same .458 rifled barrel stock — excellent hard and tough chrome moly steel — whether rollmarked 45-70 or 45-90. The ONLY difference is the fractional amount deeper the chambering reamers cut.
It is perfectly safe to shoot factory 45-70 ammunition in a new 45-90 chambered Winchester. The breech pressure and velocity will be marginally less because of the additional freebore — A WHOLE THREE TENTHS OF AN INCH. Wow.
The 45-70 case is about 2.1 inches long. The 45-90 case is 2.4 inches long.
The original 45-90 Winchesters were given a slow 1-in-32 twist to shoot 300 grain bullets as fast as possible. An “Express” cartridge. The new barrel stock is rifled 1-in-20 for both chamberings, the standard twist for the shorter cartridge. The new 45-90 Winchester shoots modern 300 grain bullets just fine and, unlike its predecessors, also can handle 400 grain and some 500 grain bullets well.
For the record, you can get enough smokeless powder into the shorter 45-70 case to send shooter and rifle to the Moon in pieces, too.
While some agonize about adding wads or fillers to the longer case to take up unused powder space, most rational smokeless loadings of the 45-70 do not completely fill the case, without adverse result. Treat the new 45-90 Winchester like a 45-70 and be happy.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
