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Model 1890 Serial Number Confusion
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Ft.Worth, Texas
Posts: 142
April 16, 2021 - 12:40 am

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I picked up a Winchester Model 1890 in 22 short today and it has a confusing serial number of 793204. The Winchester database shows it to have been made in 1928 but Proofhouse has a note that says “Actual production of guns reached serial number 752,044. After 1932 serial numbers were chosen at random; many numbers were skipped and the highest serial number recorded is 849,100”. Anyone have a definitive answer ?

Thanks, Cliff

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Northern edge of the D/FW Metromess
Posts: 4824
April 16, 2021 - 2:51 am

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Doesn’t sound right to me, Cliff. According to the Red Book production slowed dramatically in 1932. The Model 06 probably had something to do with the conclusion Proofhouse reached because some later Model 90 frames were used to build 06’s. Red Book has a brief explanation of the clean-up rifles, I think Schwing discusses it in his first book but it’s late. If someone with a better memory doesn’t chime in I’ll research that for you in the next few days.

 

Mike

Life Member TSRA, Endowment Member NRA
BBHC Member, TGCA Member
Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe
I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call, Lonesome Dove
Some of my favorite recipes start out with a handful of depleted counterbalance devices.-TXGunNut
Presbyopia be damned, I'm going to shoot this thing! -TXGunNut
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Ohio
Posts: 377
April 16, 2021 - 2:52 am

3sp_QuotePost

 red book chapter 5 represents rifles manufactured from 1920-1942 with serial number range of 649453-854745. The fact that Cody has the records also would lead me to say it’s correct. 

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Ft.Worth, Texas
Posts: 142
April 16, 2021 - 2:57 am

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Thanks Mike! Yeah..something is strange for sure. I am certain  that it is original and I wonder why Winchester dates it to 1928.

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Ft.Worth, Texas
Posts: 142
April 16, 2021 - 3:00 am

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Bill Hanzel said
 red book chapter 5 represents rifles manufactured from 1920-1942 with serial number range of 649453-854745. The fact that Cody has the records also would lead me to say it’s correct.   

Thanks for checking that for me Bill. What is the “Red Book” that you guys are referring to?

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Ohio
Posts: 377
April 16, 2021 - 3:08 am

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image.jpgImage EnlargerI believe it’s available in the store right here on the website. In my opinion it’s a must have, worth every penny.

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Ft.Worth, Texas
Posts: 142
April 16, 2021 - 3:23 am

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Thanks Bill! I just ordered one. Half price too!

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Kingston, WA
Posts: 10537
April 16, 2021 - 3:29 am

8sp_QuotePost

Cliff said
I picked up a Winchester Model 1890 in 22 short today and it has a confusing serial number of 793204. The Winchester database shows it to have been made in 1928 but Proofhouse has a note that says “Actual production of guns reached serial number 752,044. After 1932 serial numbers were chosen at random; many numbers were skipped and the highest serial number recorded is 849,100”. Anyone have a definitive answer ?

Thanks, Cliff  

Cliff,

Model 90 S/N 793204 was manufactured December 1st, 1928.  The information you found on Proofhouse is erroneous. Winchester never “randomly” chose serial numbers, nor did they “skip” any serial numbers for the Model 90.  What did happen, is that on March 10th, 1926 (at S/N 713199), Winchester merged the serial numbers of the Model 90 with the Model 06.  The Model 06 serial numbers ended at 685999 on March 10th, 1926, and resumed in the Model 90 S/N range at 713200.  From March 10th, 1926 through June 6th, 1932, the Models 90 and 06 were all in the 713200 – 846022 serial number range (no numbers skipped).  Beginning in February of 1933, Winchester began parts clean-up production of the Model 90 and 06 and continued sporadic production until S/N 854747 was reached (in late November 1949 when the final two rifles were assembled).  No production took place between July 20th, 1942 and November 23, 1949.

Your Model 90 was simply one of the standard production rifles manufactured during the time period when the Model 90 and Model 06 shared the same serial number range.

Bert

p.s. I have entered your Model 90 rifle in the research survey that is in progress documenting the merged production time period. 

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

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Ft.Worth, Texas
Posts: 142
April 16, 2021 - 3:44 am

9sp_QuotePost

Bert H. said

Cliff,

Model 90 S/N 793204 was manufactured December 1st, 1928.  The information you found on Proofhouse is erroneous. Winchester never “randomly” chose serial numbers, nor did they “skip” any serial numbers for the Model 90.  What did happen, is that on March 10th, 1926 (at S/N 713199), Winchester merged the serial numbers of the Model 90 with the Model 06.  The Model 06 serial numbers ended at 685999 on March 10th, 1926, and resumed in the Model 90 S/N range at 713200.  From March 10th, 1926 through June 6th, 1932, the Models 90 and 06 were all in the 713200 – 846022 serial number range (no numbers skipped).  Beginning in February of 1933, Winchester began parts clean-up production of the Model 90 and 06 and continued sporadic production until S/N 854747 was reached (in late November 1949 when the final two rifles were assembled).  No production took place between July 20th, 1942 and November 23, 1949.

Your Model 90 was simply one of the standard production rifles manufactured during the time period when the Model 90 and Model 06 shared the same serial number range.

Bert

p.s. I have entered your Model 90 rifle in the research survey that is in progress documenting the merged production time period.   

 

Bert, I cant thank you enough! Great information as always!

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Posts: 2282
April 18, 2021 - 3:28 pm

10sp_QuotePost

Bert H. said

Cliff,

Model 90 S/N 793204 was manufactured December 1st, 1928.  The information you found on Proofhouse is erroneous. Winchester never “randomly” chose serial numbers, nor did they “skip” any serial numbers for the Model 90.  What did happen, is that on March 10th, 1926 (at S/N 713199), Winchester merged the serial numbers of the Model 90 with the Model 06.  The Model 06 serial numbers ended at 685999 on March 10th, 1926, and resumed in the Model 90 S/N range at 713200.  From March 10th, 1926 through June 6th, 1932, the Models 90 and 06 were all in the 713200 – 846022 serial number range (no numbers skipped).  Beginning in February of 1933, Winchester began parts clean-up production of the Model 90 and 06 and continued sporadic production until S/N 854747 was reached (in late November 1949 when the final two rifles were assembled).  No production took place between July 20th, 1942 and November 23, 1949.

Your Model 90 was simply one of the standard production rifles manufactured during the time period when the Model 90 and Model 06 shared the same serial number range.

Bert

p.s. I have entered your Model 90 rifle in the research survey that is in progress documenting the merged production time period.   

Bert. Weren’t the last numbers used to build M62-A’s? Most I have seen with numbers in the 85,000 range, are like my M62-A # 853279B. Thanks, Big Larry

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Kingston, WA
Posts: 10537
April 18, 2021 - 6:17 pm

11sp_QuotePost

Big Larry said

Bert. Weren’t the last numbers used to build M62-A’s? Most I have seen with numbers in the 85,000 range, are like my M62-A # 853279B. Thanks, Big Larry  

Larry,

During the parts clean-up production (S/Ns 846023 – 854747) there was a total of 8,725 rifles assembled.  Of that number, we have currently surveyed (120) rifles. The table below shows the ratio of the models we have surveyed thus far in that final clean-up.  As you can see, the Model 90 far outpaces the Model 62A

Final Run/Cleanups Models (S/Ns > 846022)
Model 06 62 62A 90 Total
Quantity 17 28 22 53 120
% of Total 14.17% 23.33% 18.33% 44.17% 100.00%
Projected 1,236 2,036 1,600 3,854 8,725

Bert

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

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Posts: 2282
April 18, 2021 - 8:46 pm

12sp_QuotePost

We have gone over this many times and I think I have it straight. I just wondered why you didn’t mention the M62-A in your post. Thanks, Big Larry

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Kingston, WA
Posts: 10537
April 18, 2021 - 9:30 pm

13sp_QuotePost

Big Larry said
We have gone over this many times and I think I have it straight. I just wondered why you didn’t mention the M62-A in your post. Thanks, Big Larry  

Larry,

I did not mention it because it was not germane to the posted question, which was regarding a late production Model 90… not a “parts clean-up” rifle.

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

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Posts: 2282
April 19, 2021 - 1:35 am

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I am sure further info would be appreciated by some folks on this Forum. It is sometime a learning Forum, and we are fortunate to have one of the best teachers here. Semper Fi my friend.   Big Larry

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Northern edge of the D/FW Metromess
Posts: 4824
April 19, 2021 - 3:00 am

15sp_QuotePost

That was embarrassing, I forgot I had a 62A. Was dragging guns out of the safe tonight for the TGCA show next weekend and there it was. Embarassed Pretty nice one, too! It was on my inventory, not gonna mention the one that wasn’t. I put it back next to my 1890 so I could find it. Maybe an 06 will show up between now and Cody. Wink

 

Mike

Life Member TSRA, Endowment Member NRA
BBHC Member, TGCA Member
Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe
I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call, Lonesome Dove
Some of my favorite recipes start out with a handful of depleted counterbalance devices.-TXGunNut
Presbyopia be damned, I'm going to shoot this thing! -TXGunNut
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