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March 13, 2022
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I am interested in knowing more about the selectors available for the 1873 22cal. rifles. I see from the research done by James Gordon out of 283 22 cal. guns 3 of the 22 short guns had selectors & 1 of the 22 cal. EX long guns had a selector. Could there been 2 styles selectors? I am glad to see the article in the 2025 winter Winchester collector magazine by Pete Hynard. He explained the short & long variations used the same elevator block & the same cartridge stop. The elevator block having 2 sets of holes so when the rifle was assembled in the factory, the workers installed the stop in the correct hole for that cartridge.
May 2, 2009
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Gail,
In Gordon’s book he talks about the about a 22 serial 515797 the one that letters with 2 complete barrel assemblies and he say it has a selector. I have that gun and it is just the elevator with the two holes to move the cartridge stop for shorts or longs. Most 73 22’s will have this feature like Pete’s in the latest Winchester Collector. I would not classify that kind as a selector. The ones with the lever to adjust for cartridge length like the one on page 520 serial 194605 is a true selector where you can adjust the gun without disassembly. There are not many with the selector. I have one, serial 194605.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
March 13, 2022
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That is a very nice gun. In the book by Bruce McDowel the Evolution of the Winchester page 151 Curtis & Russell patented a adjustable stop that you could change short to long without having to take the gun apart. Was that ever made? Gail
May 2, 2009
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Gail,
I don’t have that book. How does the Curtis Russell adjustable stop work?
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
December 9, 2002
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Bob,
I also don’t have that book and am curious to see what it looks like.
Anthony
March 13, 2022
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Bob I will send a copy of page 151 of Bruce McDowell’s
May 2, 2009
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Gail,
I have only seen 2 types of cartridge adjusters in the 22’s. The one that you have to remove the elevator to move and the one with the lever like figure 2 in the patent drawing. I have not seen anything like the figure 6, the sliding bar. One thing I have learned reading these old patents is the text and pictures in them somewhat resemble the final production part but can have big differences. I looked at my Extra long gun with the selector lever and noticed it had 4 positions. It has the short and long positions and then it has two positions close together for the extra long. I have some 22 extra long made in Switzerland that feeds correctly in the #3 position that I shoot. The Winchester brand Extra Long shells are slightly longer and work in the #4 position but never tried to fire them.
I have continued the survey that Jim Gordon started and to date I have 2734 in 22 caliber.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
December 9, 2002
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Gail,
Thanks for posting that Article from the book that you mentioned. A lot of information in there! 
1873man said
Gail,
I have only seen 2 types of cartridge adjusters in the 22’s. The one that you have to remove the elevator to move and the one with the lever like figure 2 in the patent drawing. I have not seen anything like the figure 6, the sliding bar. One thing I have learned reading these old patents is the text and pictures in them somewhat resemble the final production part but can have big differences. I looked at my Extra long gun with the selector lever and noticed it had 4 positions. It has the short and long positions and then it has two positions close together for the extra long. I have some 22 extra long made in Switzerland that feeds correctly in the #3 position that I shoot. The Winchester brand Extra Long shells are slightly longer and work in the #4 position but never tried to fire them.
I have continued the survey that Jim Gordon started and to date I have 2734 in 22 caliber.
Bob
Bob,
That says a lot to me as if you state you haven’t seen like the figure 6, as the sliding bar shows, that’s very significant information regarding these findings. IMO!
Anthony
March 13, 2022
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Bob
Have you seen one like the one with the lever in picture 2? I don’t know if you can read this. It reads on the top of the page right column the adjustment is made from long cartridges to short cartridges and the reveres by pushing the lever outward from the carrier block far enough to clear the stop pin h,and placing it forward or rearward. thus placing the inward projecting pin f to the position of the desired cartridge length. ( f is the cartridge stop.)
May 2, 2009
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Gail,
Yes I have seen the lever style like figure 2 but like I stated before the production lever selector is not exactly the same as its described in the patent. I have the serial 194605, the one pictured on page 520 in the Gordon book and pictured in the Madis book. From what I see in my research there is only 3 with the levers
Here is a picture of the elevator on it.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
May 2, 2009
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There are two with levers in the Madis book and the third is in the Cody Museum but the serial number comes back as a 44 caliber carbine so I searched the Inventory of the Winchester Repeating Arms Company Reference Collection book and found it. It must not had a lower tang in it since they didn’t list a serial number for it and they usually do if its got one and when it was sent to Cody they put one in to display it.
Here is the link to the full Curtis & Russel patent.
https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/43/95/c6/50b2cd85a26628/US316880.pdf
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
March 13, 2022
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.Bob I agree with the author of the book Evolution of the Winchester. There were two selectors for the 1873 guns. The survey James Gorgon done of 283 guns, 3 of the 22 short guns had a selector. I think they used the pivot style in picture 2. The only way they had to be changed is from short to long & back. They had no reason for the sliding selector that moved far enough for the EX Long cartridges. The only way it can be proved is to see one of the rifles & the factory letter. You have seen the rifles that have the sliding selector & how they work. That is proof of it. Gail
May 2, 2009
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Gail,
The factory records don’t mention the selectors at all.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
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