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I have seen excerpts on-line of actual hand written factory records either scanned or photocopied of Winchester firearms belonging to a collectors Winchester. I have a wonderful little Model 1890 with many factory options and was thinking something like this would really compliment it. Does anybody know if or how I can get an actual copy of the record of my rifle?
Thanks,
Len
Len,
Here is a link to the Cody Records department. First check the list to see if your gun is included in the in the ledger by serial number. Not all Model 90’s have records. If it is in the ledgers then fill out the form and you might have to call to get Jesi to include a copy of the ledger line with the letter you will get. Last month they had a special going on for non members (Cody Members) but its over now.
https://centerofthewest.org/explore/firearms/firearms-records/
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
If you arent a CFM member….good luck to you. I called and offered to pay for what at most would be 30 minutes of additional research. Not being a CFM member i was basically told to pound sand until I was.
Its a perk for being a member. Its just like the perks WACA gives its members. If they gave the perks to everyone then they would not have paying members. The research is $50 per hour, one hour minimum so I being a member couldn’t just pay for 30 minutes of research.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
I would have gladly paid $50 for an hour. For me, being a Cody member just doesnt make sense financially since my collection only consists of a few firearms that would pertain to the CFM.
Now, if i had a collection like some of you guys, and the money to add to it, CFM membership would be of much more value.
I e-mailed three times, no response. I called CFM this afternoon from work. I was told only members can get a photo of the ledger. The photo would be the line corresponding to the subject rifle and one line above and one line below. I was told that would be the case ONLY if the ledger was unreadable. That doesn’t make ANY sense to me at all. I asked if I could get a photo IF the document is readable. I was told no. I asked if I donated $150 to CFM in lieu of membership would I be able to get a photo of the ledger regardless. Again I was told no.
I really don’t need a membership because I live way over on the east coast in upstate NY and don’t really need multiple firearm searches or family admission discounts. I suppose I was told to “pound salt” too…………
November 7, 2015
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I’m a proud member/supporter of the CFM. It’s not about my collection or the searches or even the letters. It’s about supporting a fine museum and preserving the archives of Winchester for future collectors. It takes serious money to do these things and the fine folks at CFM are doing a great job, IMHO, and I want them to be able to continue to do so. I’ll admit the tightwad in me likes the free admission but I always manage to negate that with a donation whenever I visit. 
If you can’t justify a trip to tour the museum, at least tour the site. Good stuff.
Ya’ll just cost this ol’ tightwad some money. 
Check’s in the mail, CFM!
TXGunNut said
I’m a proud member/supporter of the CFM. It’s not about my collection or the searches or even the letters. It’s about supporting a fine museum and preserving the archives of Winchester for future collectors. It takes serious money to do these things and the fine folks at CFM are doing a great job, IMHO, and I want them to be able to continue to do so. I’ll admit the tightwad in me likes the free admission but I always manage to negate that with a donation whenever I visit.If you can’t justify a trip to tour the museum, at least tour the site. Good stuff.
Ya’ll just cost this ol’ tightwad some money.
I was at the CFM sometime in 1978 and was very impressed with the many exhibits especially the American art. However, I offered the price of a $150.00 membership for a photocopy of the record of my rifle. Don’t quite fully understand your statement “preserving the archives for future collectors” when collectors cannot obtain a copy of an important component of one of their most prized pieces. I would think CFM would be happy to document one of their archived documented pieces is still alive and well for over 117 years. I have been in the Winchester collecting game for over 50 years and I thought an authentic historic excerpt of the Winchester record of one of my rifles would make a great presentation piece. Guess that’s not gonna happen any time soon……..
November 7, 2015
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I’ve seen electronic images of one of the ledgers the CFM folks use to gather info for searches and letters. At the time they probably felt photocopying the ledger page might damage it and they may have been right considering the technology of the time. Bert has spent many hours with these ledgers and can tell you much more about their contents and the methods CFM uses to protect them. The format isn’t very user-friendly, at least the page I saw. Most entries have very little info. Beautiful handwriting, BTW! I don’t know for certain why they wouldn’t produce a copy of the page you’re interested in but sometimes they do things I don’t agree with, won’t stop me from visiting and supporting the CFM. They may now be able to print a copy of the electronic image in some cases but the search result format they use is much more useful, for me anyway.
A photograph without using a flash won’t hurt the documentation as far as I know. That’s why flash photography isn’t allowed in museums etc. I think a photocopy would serve the same purpose as a letter anyway. After all the letter is based on the factory documented records I assume. It really isn’t a big issue to me anyway as I have somewhere in my home a factory letter on this rifle. Just have to work up enough interest and energy to hunt it up……..
They don’t look at the original documents unless they are trying to see some detail that the digital scans they use on a daily basis might not show or trying to figure out if a different color ink was used to add a notation to a line afterwards. When Jesi is at a gun show, she has the digital scans on a computer.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
November 7, 2015
Offline
1873man said
They don’t look at the original documents unless they are trying to see some detail that the digital scans they use on a daily basis might not show or trying to figure out if a different color ink was used to add a notation to a line afterwards. When Jesi is at a gun show, she has the digital scans on a computer.
Bob
Yes, but OP was referring to a request made in 1978. Much has changed since then. It’s very possible that Jesi is much more responsive to our requests than previous CFM employees….no, it’s quite probable that she is and I can probably prove it! The relationship between WACA and CFM is strong and I hope to see it grow stronger.
Jesi is a valued member here, I’d love to sit on a stool in a corner and watch her work some day.
Actually its getting harder to get a copy of the ledger entry out of Cody. Years ago you could ask for a picture of the ledger entry for your gun and you got the whole page and as time went on you got less and less, now you might get a line above and one below if the entry in question hard to read or they can’t interpret it. I just tried about a month ago to get a copy of a entry and couldn’t.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
January 26, 2011
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Bob
Yes, but OP was referring to a request made in 1978. Much has changed since then. It’s very possible that Jesi is much more responsive to our requests than previous CFM employees….no, it’s quite probable that she is and I can probably prove it! The relationship between WACA and CFM is strong and I hope to see it grow stronger.
Jesi is a valued member here, I’d love to sit on a stool in a corner and watch her work some day.
I agree. Jesi and Connie have always went out of their way to help out and get the information I’ve ask for. We (WACA) do have a great relationship with the folks at CFM. I recently spent quite a bit of time with Jesi at the Reno show as she did some extra research for me on the Atlanta Police 1873 rifles. I was impressed that she seemed just as excited about gathering the information as I was, and it was my rifle.
~Gary~
1badf350 said
I would have gladly paid $50 for an hour. For me, being a Cody member just doesnt make sense financially since my collection only consists of a few firearms that would pertain to the CFM.Now, if i had a collection like some of you guys, and the money to add to it, CFM membership would be of much more value.
I agree with you wholeheartedly since my situation is similar. I donated the $150.00 once and although the ladies were extremely helpful, donating that amount yearly is not for me or my wallet, since the wife and I donate to everybody and their brother from children’s hospitals to animals. I have seen long time members here help out complete strangers by getting this information for them in such circumstances…hopefully, one of these folks will do the same for a member of the forum.
James
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