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Notice that the winner so far is unrated — surely a newbie (or a shill).
B
With limited funds–everyone has a budget of some sort–why even bother with refinished or restored? Better to save a bit longer and buy something nicer. A “no excuses” gun, not something with problems.
I really enjoy how we all have different tastes, perspectives, opinions and so on. Even though I don’t like refinished or even restored rifles, I do have rifles that have other modifications that other collectors would frown upon – such as a rebarreling.
November 7, 2015
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I agree it’s been refinished at some point but I suspect it’s been awhile. It’s a very attractive rifle but…the current collector market won’t justify the current bid, IMHO. OTOH if you bought a 20-30% gun and wanted to bring it up to this level it’s quite possible to spend this much and more. I love the cartridge and I love deluxe wood but I’d only buy this rifle if I had no intention of selling it any time soon.
I still think we’ve seen this seller before under another name.
Mike
Hi guys,
Sorry that I have not been around for a while. The rifle was previously sold at RIA in June as lot #3060. In the description at that time it is stated that the gun is “factory refurbished” https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/79/3060/special-order-winchester-deluxe-model-1892-lever-action-rifle
It certainly is a nice configuration and good looking. But if you want 100% original it may not be the gun for you.
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
What does “factory refurbished” mean?
First and foremost, RIA should be ashamed of writing such a blatant lie! If they truly believe this, their experts are very unknowledgeable.
Secondly, Winchester would never refinish such that buffing is evident and the gun has wrench marks on the barrel and the finish does not look factory original.
Thirdly, if factory refurbished, what documentation (none) proves this?
How much did RIA sell this rifle for?
It sold for $8625.
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
twobit said
It sold for $8625.
I want to say someone got burnt but Gunbroker to the rescue to bail them out!
mrcvs said
twobit said
It sold for $8625.I want to say someone got burnt but Gunbroker to the rescue to bail them out!
Anyone who buys from the large auction houses and then resells them again is always taking a risk. But I often see many rifles which go this way and the majority of the time money is made on the deal. Lots of the well known “dealers” are nothing but go between the auction house and other buyers. I certainly put no blame on Gunbroker. It is always important to buy from a position of knowledge or be aware that you may make a mistake.
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
Online
Shame on the Gunbroker seller for not mentioning anything about a refinish. Trying to turn a quick buck by peddling as original? Preying on the uneducated is a lucrative business.
That gun would just complicate life.
“If you can’t convince them, confuse them”
President Harry S. Truman
Tedk said
That gun would just complicate life.
I think maybe you’ve hit the core issue for me. I notice I have a real aversion to this gun. And maybe that’s because if I owned it, it would complicate my life in a way that I very much would not enjoy. Aside from the fact that I really dislike the way it’s been refinished, the lies and deception that are attached adds a taint to it. I won’t say I would never consider a refinished rifle but the rarity would have to be substantial. Take this rifle for example. If the only alteration were the refinishing, and IF it had an original 36 inch barrel, I’d amend how I looked at it.
What if you didn’t buy guns that you have not picked up and looked at ???????? There is a learning experience here but unfortunately not for the current buyer. He may find out soon though.
I’m not sure I have ever found an Auction house that is completely knowledgeable and completely honest.
twobit said
I certainly put no blame on Gunbroker.
No, I’m not blaming Gunbroker but it perpetually seems to be a site where individuals throw common sense to the wind and overpay for most everything.
If you haven’t read the entire RIA description please do! It does not say it was factory refurbished, it says “factory refurbished quality blue finish”, not the same. The word quality changes the meaning. It also goes on to say proof markings and other marking thin. The estimate price reflect the flaws. I see the red flags and know it’s not factory work.
Now the Gunbroker seller makes no claim the finish is original and does not point out the refinish, but shows pictures that clearly show buffed markings. If you know anything you know it’s refinished, if you are a novice you think it’s real and bid it up. I don’t like it but it happens at every gun show and auction. The ethical thing to do is tell the buyer what’s wrong with a gun, but all to often they say nothing.
If your a novice get help so you don’t pay $8625 for a reblued $3500 gun! These descriptions or lack of will not stop. When this gun was posted on the Forum it was immediateley identified as reblued. USE THE FORUM! T/R
steve004 said
I think maybe you’ve hit the core issue for me. I notice I have a real aversion to this gun. And maybe that’s because if I owned it, it would complicate my life in a way that I very much would not enjoy. Aside from the fact that I really dislike the way it’s been refinished, the lies and deception that are attached adds a taint to it. I won’t say I would never consider a refinished rifle but the rarity would have to be substantial. Take this rifle for example. If the only alteration were the refinishing, and IF it had an original 36 inch barrel, I’d amend how I looked at it.
I’m quoting myself here. The reason I mentioned it would take something like a 36 inch barrel to interest me in a refinished rifle comes from an example way back. I would say right around 37 or 38 years ago, I was offered a Winchester M1894 .32-40 with a 36 inch barrel with full magazine). My recollection is it was a round barrel. It was all original, except the seller said it was factory refinished. And it may well have been. I don’t think I knew if it was marked as such or there was something in the ledger. I do recall the price was $6500. There were no special features other than the long barrel. I recall the refinish aspect held me back from pursuing it. If the same rifle to come my way, and there was adequate markings or provenance to legitimize the factory refinish claim, I would be fairly interested. Were it refinished like the one on gunbroker, I’d still be interested because of the extreme rarity, but the refinishing would bug me for as long as I owned the rifle. At this stage in my life, I recognize the folly of acquiring things that bug me.
BOBR94 said
Notice that the winner so far is unrated — surely a newbie (or a shill).B
To me, it looks like a shill running it up. I don’t claim to not be jaded however 😉
mrcvs said No, I’m not blaming Gunbroker but it perpetually seems to be a site where individuals throw common sense to the wind and overpay for most everything.
Ditto for ebay.
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