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I have this 1873 Winchester 3rd. model. Sr. # 158692A circa 1884, with a 28″ octagon barrel with full magazine 44wcf and set trigger . The barrel in front of the breach measurement is 0.955′ the measurement at the muzzle is 0.805″, this is the measurement that is under size for a heavy barrel. Tapper is 0.150″ . More than the normal 0.136″ or there about. This rifle and its barrel appear to be un altered in any way. I have read that the barrel measurements may vary + or -. Question would this barrel still be considered a heavy barrel? Being 0.015″ at the muzzle smaller that the book states it should be. Thanks in advance for any help or answer. ,,,,,DT
Dusty,
We did a survey of 73 barrel dimensions a few years ago and your barrel is a standard barrel. The average of the breech is .945″ and the muzzle average is .810″
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
Thank You 1873 man . In the survey you mention, were 1st/2nd and 3rd. models all included in the survey? And were there any differences in the 1st /2nd and 3rd models or are they all supposed to measure the same? And also what are the measurements that determine where (standard barrel) and( heavy barrel ) and( extra heavy barrel) start and stop? Is there any literature available that was produced by Winchester that states these measurements? Sorry for all the questions but this is something I find very interesting!,,,,,,DT
Dusty,
The survey was of just rifles in all calibers and models in one group. I didn’t find any differences that stand out between the models beside the inherent differences in barrel size because of caliber. The thing I got out of the survey is that there isn’t a “Heavy” barrel and the early 73’s didn’t have barrels that were heavier than the later ones. The Winchester ledgers listed “Heavy” and “Extra Heavy” barrels but they where all referring to the Extra Heavy barrel which is 1″ at the muzzle. There wasn’t any Extra Heavy guns included in the survey. The one interesting thing I learned about Extra Heavy’s is the receiver is heavier to accommodate the heavy barrel. I haven’t found any documentation about barrel dimensions as of yet.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
1873 man ,sorry for the delay with my reply. You stated in your last comment that from your survey ,you came to the conclusion that there are( no heavy barrel 1873 Winchesters) only( Extra heavy barrels) . This brings me to another question. In the book (Winchester Lever Action Repeating Firearms) Volume 1,( For Collectors Only) The Models of 1866,1873 & 1876. written by Arthur Pirkle, he states that the Model 1873 had( Heavy barrel rifles). On pg.98 , barrel and taper measurements can be seen for different models. Table 2-III , list 3rd. model .44 caliber octagon barrel – rifle as (Standard) Breech dia. 0.892 and muzzle dia. as 0.756 . And ( Heavy ) being 0.956 at the breech and a muzzle of 0.820 . The Model 1873 Winchester 28″ .44 cal. oct . barrel in question has measurements very close to this @ Breech 0.955 and muzzle of 0.805 . This is what lead me to believe this may be considered a Heavy barrel rifle. My question is . Do you think this book is incorrect ? Or is it out- dated information, that your survey has proved incorrect? ,,,,,,,DT
What I did is plot all the barrel data on a chart and when you look at it you don’t see a defined group at any barrel size. You would think if Winchester set out to make a barrel with distinct different sizes there would be a recognizable pattern but I can’t see it. I have a chart in Excel that I can post but not until tonight. About all I can see is the manufacturing tolerance might have tightened up later in production.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
Dusty,
I plotted all the breech and muzzle measurements for 44 caliber rifles on one chart along with lines where Pirkle said the Standard 3rd model, Heavy 3rd model and Standard 1st/2nd barrel sizes are. Your gun I plotted in green. After looking where his line for Standard 3rd model lies, which is away from any guns I can conclude his Standard 3rd model size is bogus. His other lines lie in with the guns but I don’t see pattern.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
Just as an FYI. On my 2nd model 73 rifle also with a 28 inch barrel, the muzzle measures at .9687 (31/32). This gun is original and LETTER as HEAVY. Also, to add to the discussion, I recently handled an original 86 short barreled rifle that letters as EX HEAVY. It measured exactly an inch at the muzzle. Hope this adds value to the discussion.
http://merzantiques.com/photo/w1476-winchester-model-1873-rifle
Here is a perfect side by side comparison. Once you see and hold one there is no doubt.
I have a heavy barrel model 73 in 38 WCF. It measures exactly 1 inch at the muzzle. I would post a picture, but have not figured out how to do it from my iPad.
Heavy and Extra Heavy mean the same thing in the ledgers.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
nanzca & Blueliner: Thanks for the link to Merz & the pictures of the subject rifle’s heavy barrel and serial number, plus the ledger information. I have updated my copy of James D. Gordon’s Survey of the Winchester Model 1873 to reflect these points.
My mistake Gordon’s survey had this info noted.
Added: Skimming through Gordon’s Survey of the 1873, he shows about 150 with the “Round Heavy Barrel”, plus about 45 with the “Octagon Extra Heavy Barrel”, and about 2 of the “Round Barrel Extra Heavy”.
James
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