Jim91 said

Bert H. said
Jim,
What you have is actually a "Tournament Gun" versus a Trap Gun.  Winchester introduced it as a new variant in the year 1910.  Your Tournament Gun was manufactured in August 1912.
What (if anything) is molded (marked) on the recoil pad?  In the year 1912, Winchester would  (on special order) fit the Model 1897 with a Silvers or Jotsam recoil pad.
I will assume that your gun has a 30-inch Full choke barrel, and that it is roll matted?
I recently wrote an article discussing the Model 1897 production (published in the Spring 2026 WACA Collector magazine - 2026 Spring (winchestercollector.org)
Bert
  

Hi Bert,
 
Thank you for the info on my 97. I have attached a few more pics to help answer your questions
 
below is what I was able to find about the butt pad
The buttplate is a Jostam “Anti-Flinch” recoil pad, not an original Winchester part. These were made by the Jostam Manufacturing Company of Chicago, and the patent numbers trace two distinct versions: the earlier J.S. Day patent from October 29, 1914, and a later W.R. Jorgenson patent granted October 12, 1915. Since your gun was made in 1912–13 and this pad wasn’t even patented until 1914–15, this confirms it’s a period aftermarket accessory added sometime after the gun left the factory — not original equipment. That’s not a bad thing at all; Jostam Anti-Flinch pads are themselves genuinely collectible and hard to find today, to the point where collectors have reportedly bought entire “project guns” just to get one of these pads. So this is a nice period-correct addition, just not factory-original to this specific gun.

All of this positive Jostam pad talk makes me feel a whole lot better about the Jostam pad on on my Burgess shotgun.  I think my pad is a very early pad (but not of course original to the Burgess).  It is marked, "NO KICK COMING RECOIL PAD" and, "PAT. 1842525".

I did read in the Madis book that on special order Winchester would provide various recoil pads and this included Jostam pads.  I assume this started about 1914.

Sadly, I've never owned a Model 42.  However, I do have a repeating .410 shotgun made just a couple years before the M42 came out:

george@georgeamlott.com said
Bert,
I’ll have to let my wallet catch it’s breath before I go back to his house again….
  

Run an oxygen tube into it!  Probably need that tube hooked up to a big cannister.  Set it on high flow!

I’ll have to let my wallet catch it’s breath before I go back to his house again….

steve004 said
 
What caliber is the Savage in?
  

.300

What caliber is the Savage in?

Bert H. said
George,
My recommendation is to commit yourself to buying every gun that your older friend offers you.  He apparently had a very discerning eye, and he assembled a collection of very fine old Winchesters.
Bert
  

I have !!!!!

Even a few from other teams…😎

My recommendation is to commit yourself to buying every gun that your older friend offers you.  He apparently had a very discerning eye, and he assembled a collection of very fine old Winchesters.

Bert

Jim91 said

Bert,
Is there any way for me to research whether the recoil pad was installed by Winchester during an R&R?
  

Unfortunately, No, there is not.  The original factory ledger records for the Model 1897 end at serial number 377999. 

The clues that it may have been installed by Winchester are; (1) the type of pad that it is (Jotsam), (2) the black backing spacer, (3) the LOP, and (4) the fit to the stock.

Bert

Mike

Bert H. said

Jim91 said

Bert H. said
Jim,
You are welcome, and the Jotsam recoil pad is definitely period correct to the gun.  It has undoubtedly been on the butt stock for nearly the entire life of the gun, and very likely several years before Winchester began offering their own recoil pads (in 1922).  It is possible that it was installed by Winchester during an "R&R".  What is the LOP?
Bert
  

Attaching a pick for LOP. Do you think the butt was cut down to accommodate the pad?
  

Yes, the butt stock was shortened to install the recoil pad.  It does appear to be vert close to the correct LOP for a Tournament Gun.  Per the catalog description, the LOP for the Tournament Guns was 14".

Bert
  

Bert,

Is there any way for me to research whether the recoil pad was installed by Winchester during an R&R?