Unlike the Model 70, for which there was a large pent up demand,  the demand for the Winchester Model 21 shotgun was only a trickle, particularly in the specialty styles. My Model 21 Skeet Gun's Cody letter says it was made in 1947 but it has 26" barrels and larger 20 LPI checkering patterns than specified in a 1946 production change order. That CO changed barrel length of the Skeet Gun to 28" and called for smaller patterns cut to 18 LPI. 

As an aside, the postwar catalogue description of the Skeet Gun makes no mention of a higher grade wood finish than the Standard/Field Grade gun. But my letter mentions the wood finish as "Skeet Finish" and in fact the Walnut is better than chair leg and has a high luster finish. 

Winchester seemingly was not over its in- house Independent Contractor culture and production supervisors were more concerned with getting guns to the warehouse than placating future collectors. Combine this with the company's policy of never throwing any useable part away and it's enough to make a confused collector echo Oliver Hardy's "a fine mess you've got us in!" 

My opinion/observation is that 20 lpi on a 1946 gun would not be out of place.  The change from 20 lpi to 18 lpi was authorized sometime in 1941, but there's a lot of variability in the checkering found on M70s into about 1947.

It's probable that the change was implemented on the production line around the time it was authorized.  The checkering pattern also got a little (not much) smaller and the borders a little wider.  But IIRC checkerers got paid based on the number of stocks they finished, not by the hour.  So if the company wants to authorize a change that lets you complete more stocks in a day, why not take advantage of it?  Hence, stocks made in 1942 and beyond were probably checkered 18 lpi. 

But I suspect there were a large number of finished/checkered stocks still in inventory when commercial production was halted in August 1942, and these got used (probably somewhat randomly) when production resumed late in 1945.

Just my opinion.  I wouldn't sweat it...

Lou

My 1946-era stock/rifle seems to have 20-line, but I’m now wondering if an 18-line stock could be correct!

Or . . . .could BOTH checkering patterns be CORRECT?

Many Thanks, Gents!

antler1 said

Olsoneo87 said
I’m hoping someone here may be able to help with some research I’m working on research involving a factory-engraved Winchester Model 1894.
Does anyone have access to Armax: The Journal of the Cody Firearms Museum, Volume V (1995)? I’m specifically looking for information contained in that volume relating to Winchester engraving and factory records. If someone has a copy and would be willing to check it for me, or provide scans/photos of the relevant pages, I would greatly appreciate the help.
I’m also interested in speaking with anyone who has done detailed research into documented factory-engraved Model 1894s.
I currently have a Cody factory letter on the rifle, as well as a letter from Pauline Muerrle, and I am waiting to hear back from the Cody Firearms Museum regarding additional research. I’m trying to assemble as much primary-source and well-documented information as possible.
If anyone has the Armax volume, has researched engraved 1894s extensively, or can point me toward additional original sources, I’d be very grateful to hear from you. Feel free to reply here or send me a private message.
Thank you in advance for any help.
  

What are the letters inscribed on this 1894?
  

Pat,

It looks like EGT

Bert

Olsoneo87 said
I’m hoping someone here may be able to help with some research I’m working on research involving a factory-engraved Winchester Model 1894.
Does anyone have access to Armax: The Journal of the Cody Firearms Museum, Volume V (1995)? I’m specifically looking for information contained in that volume relating to Winchester engraving and factory records. If someone has a copy and would be willing to check it for me, or provide scans/photos of the relevant pages, I would greatly appreciate the help.
I’m also interested in speaking with anyone who has done detailed research into documented factory-engraved Model 1894s.
I currently have a Cody factory letter on the rifle, as well as a letter from Pauline Muerrle, and I am waiting to hear back from the Cody Firearms Museum regarding additional research. I’m trying to assemble as much primary-source and well-documented information as possible.
If anyone has the Armax volume, has researched engraved 1894s extensively, or can point me toward additional original sources, I’d be very grateful to hear from you. Feel free to reply here or send me a private message.
Thank you in advance for any help.
  

What are the letters inscribed on this 1894?

What caliber is it chambered in?

I'm guessing 38-55?

Sincerely,

Maverick

Steven Gabrielli said

I think gungoodies is their eBay name, these shipped from Ocala when I ordered one.
  

That would make sense too, they may have changed their account name or have more than one...definitely the same product. I spoke to them on the phone once but I should have asked them where they were sourcing these just out of curiosity. 

Jeremy P said

Steven Gabrielli said
I am sure this was discussed somewhere on this forum, but I can’t remember where.But if you need a space filler, this is where I go.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/155857474754
  

Yes, these are also good. Same as what OARMORY (Ocala Armory in Florida) sells on eBay....most of these nicer, aftermarket, double bevel shaped ones are available in short and tall heights only (pretty much), based on the model you're targeting.
One of the first few things I ever dug into or asked about on the forums was sight hoods, and man, did I quickly find myself in a rabbit hole! 🙂
  

I think gungoodies is their eBay name, these shipped from Ocala when I ordered one.

Steven Gabrielli said
I am sure this was discussed somewhere on this forum, but I can’t remember where.But if you need a space filler, this is where I go.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/155857474754
  

Yes, these are also good. Same as what OARMORY (Ocala Armory in Florida) sells on eBay....most of these nicer, aftermarket, double bevel shaped ones are available in short and tall heights only (pretty much), based on the model you're targeting.

One of the first few things I ever dug into or asked about on the forums was sight hoods, and man, did I quickly find myself in a rabbit hole! 🙂

HOWEVER, the two styles of hood being reproduced by the linked seller are by far the most popular and sought after. The higher one - a clone of the #3278/M-- is the shortest one I'd consider for a Model 94 I intended to leave on while hunting, even though the shorter one replicating the 3276 is "correct." 

For the obsessed, the #3277/BL is correct for the Model 64 and the #3279/H for the Model 52 Sporting. The former is difficult to find and the latter is impossible.

The 3277 can be profitably replaced with the 3278 because it lets more light around the bead of a gun the deluxe version of which is actually called the Deer Rifle. My Deer Rifle wears a 3277 but, were I going to take the rifle hunting, I'd leave the hood in the safe. 

The 3278 does not so usefully replace the unobtainable, very tall 3279, at least for those owners of a 52 Sporting Rifle who actually shoot them with iron sights. Particularly the rare C version with high Monte Carlo comb stock cut more for scopes than irons. The 3278 does not allow enough light around the bead. I know this because I own and shoot one. 

Having actually killed deer at last light with a Model 94 carbine with  Redfield 70-E receiver sight equipped with a very large aperture and a Redfield Sourdough front sight, I found it necessary to put the 3276 factory hood in my pocket. 

Hoods are desirable for target shooting in good light but poor for making meat, in my experience. Of course, I've never taken a pot at a game animal 200 or more yards away with iron sights, like the heroes of sporting literature often did. 

Unlike some, I came to iron sights late in life and killed my first deer looking through a Weaver K4. One might think "the old [guy] just can't see in the dark well enough with lamps eight Decades along."  Wrongo, young fighters. I didn't start shooting irons seriously unti 2011, when Bausch & Lomb and an opthalmic surgeon gave me 20/20 night vision like an owl. 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/155857474754

Bert H. said

Maverick said

Bert H. said
The pictures below are scanned copies of the ARMAX list.
Serial number 11793 was the 13th engraved Model 1894.  No Model 1894s were engraved in the year 1894, and just (19) in the year 1895.
 
Bert
  

Bert,
That assumes that they were engraved in the order by serial number sequence. But they may not have been.
To know for sure, you would have to know when each serial number was engraved. I suppose you could assume that by looking at when each serial number entered the warehouse. But even that maybe only when the entered the warehouse. 
If we only had Ulrich's, Gough's, or whichever's factory timesheets!
Sincerely,
Maverick
  

The information that I provided (from the ARMAX list) is close enough.  In the case of engraved guns, the received in warehouse date would indeed be the order in which they were manufactured.  Special order guns did not languish in the factory or warehouse.
  

PM sent Bert.  Thanks for the help.