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                    <title>Louis Luttrell on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179144</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
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					                        <description><![CDATA[<p>I am NO (as in ZERO) expert on engraving!!!  I think it's a bit of "different strokes for different folks" as far as what style appeals...</p>
<p>In terms of pre-64 Winchester FACTORY M70 engraving, as far as I know there were only three possible engravers.  Alden George Ulrich (chief engraver from 1925 until his stroke in 1949), John Kusmit (George's apprentice and successor), and Nick Kusimt (who apprenticed under John)...  Of those, Ulrich and JK are known engravers of pre-64 M70s.  For example, Ulrich did the RCS (Russell C Smith) "Grail Guns" we wrote about in the Spring 2025 Collector magazine.  He also did the two (R&#038;R) Model 70s in the current RIA Premier auction.  I checked with Pauline (whose letter is used as authentication) and she did write it...</p>
<p><a href="https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/4097/3579/factory-ulrich-engraved-special-order-winchester-model-70-rifle" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/4097/3579/factory-ulrich-engraved-special-order-winchester-model-70-rifle</a></p>
<p><a href="https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/4097/3580/factory-ulrich-engraved-special-order-winchester-model-70-rifle" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/4097/3580/factory-ulrich-engraved-special-order-winchester-model-70-rifle</a></p>
<p>JK also did some M70s, most notably the famous JFK rifle (s/n 500,000) that belongs to (and in) CFM, but some others as well.  This rifle (one of my Dad's) was engraved by JK (according to Pauline).  It's the number 70-5 pattern only with a gold ram on the floor plate instead of the usual 70-5 scroll.  IMHO (and Pauline's according to the letter she wrote for me) it was definitely an outside job (not a factory special order), but it is an example of JK's ordinary low cost engraving...  The JFK gun, which is done in a deeper relief like Ulrich's style, is much closer to being in Ulrich's league than my gun...</p>
<p><img data-upload="1" data-width="5850" data-height="3450" title="SG-SN-127935-copy.jpeg" alt="SG-SN-127935-copy.jpeg" src="https://winchestercollector.org/wp-content/sp-resources/forum-image-uploads/luttrellmusc-edu/2026/05/SG-SN-127935-copy.jpeg" /></p>
<p>Martin's work (on his worst day, if he has any bad days) makes this gun look amateurish.  But for my taste, I do like Ullrich's work...</p>
<p>Just my opinion,</p>
<p>Lou</p>
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					                    <pubDate>Fri, 08 May 2026 02:46:00 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>martin rabeno on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179143</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
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					                        <description><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the compliments guys.</p>
<p>That Giovanelli rifle is pretty darn sharp though with a great inlay.  I plan on being at the Greeley show next week  I anyone is around stop and say hello. I have a 1876 I just finished.</p>
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					                    <pubDate>Fri, 08 May 2026 01:07:31 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>Buck1967 on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179141</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
                    <guid isPermaLink="true">https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179141</guid>
					                        <description><![CDATA[<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">
<p><strong>Zebulon said </strong><br />
Apparently,  Gemini is full of prunes. Buck, with all due respect, I think Grok is full of something worse. I'm no expert on engraving but, if the OP's rifle was engraved by Ulrich, then I'm Shirley Temple. <br />
I'm familiar with Martin's portfolio and reputation and I'll take his word on the subject. <br />
As I warned earlier, Gemini is frequently wrong but never in doubt. However, it was a starting point. <br />
(Lou, I do not disagree with you.)<br />
  </p>
</blockquote>
<p>Hi Zeb, I don’t disagree at all. Grok is wrong a lot but I did find it interesting that it agreed with Gemini that the style was most likely Germanic. It also stated that it was likely the result of the Custom shop which is possible I guess? Martin certainly knows engraving though and I wouldn’t like my odds disagreeing with him any more than I would arguing Winchester history with Bert! 😳 Both would end badly for me! </p>
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					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 23:39:06 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>TXGunNut on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179140</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
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					                        <description><![CDATA[<p>I was thinking German too but am not familiar with work from the land of the rising sun. Thank goodness we have an artist of Martin's caliber to keep us straight! I think the engraving is a too heavy-handed to confuse with the works of Ulrich so maybe Grok needs to lay off the grog.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Mike</p>
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					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 23:32:36 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>Buck1967 on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179139</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
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					                        <description><![CDATA[<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">
<p>
<strong>Bill Hanzel said </strong><br />
Lou, thank you for posting that link!<br />
Mr. Rabeno that is some absolutely beautiful artwork! The bear and moose receiver is some of the nicest art I have ever seen, that fact that it’s engraved on a firearm and fully visible to enjoy, is truly wonderful. <br />
  </p>
</blockquote>
<p>I agree that is one beautiful rifle and I would wager expensive! The engraving looks a lot like the Giovanelli master pieces on some of the Commemoratives like this 25th anniversary one shown below Martin’s Centennial master piece! Thank you for sharing and appreciate getting to see Martin’s amazing work and agree he is in a different league!</p>
<p><img data-upload="1" data-width="496" data-height="281" title="IMG_0097-1.jpeg" alt="IMG_0097-1.jpeg" src="https://winchestercollector.org/wp-content/sp-resources/forum-image-uploads/buck1967/2026/05/IMG_0097-1.jpeg" /></p>
<p><img data-upload="1" data-width="1024" data-height="453" title="IMG_0096.jpeg" alt="IMG_0096.jpeg" src="https://winchestercollector.org/wp-content/sp-resources/forum-image-uploads/buck1967/2026/05/IMG_0096.jpeg" /></p>
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					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 23:23:07 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>Zebulon on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179138</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
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					                        <description><![CDATA[<p>Apparently,  Gemini is full of prunes. Buck, with all due respect, I think Grok is full of something worse. I'm no expert on engraving but, if the OP's rifle was engraved by Ulrich, then I'm Shirley Temple. </p>
<p>I'm familiar with Martin's portfolio and reputation and I'll take his word on the subject. </p>
<p>As I warned earlier, Gemini is frequently wrong but never in doubt. However, it <em>was a starting point. </em></p>
<p>(Lou, I do not disagree with you.)</p>
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					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 23:08:36 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>Bill Hanzel on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179136</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
                    <guid isPermaLink="true">https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179136</guid>
					                        <description><![CDATA[<p>Lou, thank you for posting that link!</p>
<p>Mr. Rabeno that is some absolutely beautiful artwork! The bear and moose receiver is some of the nicest art I have ever seen, that fact that it’s engraved on a firearm and fully visible to enjoy, is truly wonderful. </p>
]]></description>
					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 22:11:21 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>Buck1967 on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179135</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
                    <guid isPermaLink="true">https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179135</guid>
					                        <description><![CDATA[<p>Here is Grok’s opinion on it…</p>
<p>This is a factory-engraved Winchester Model 70 bolt-action rifle with Ulrich-family engraving (likely George Ulrich, the last of the family to work at Winchester).<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></p>
<p>Your photos show the distinctive bold Germanic/American scroll engraving (dense acanthus-style vines on a punch-dot/stippled background) covering the receiver, with an oval medallion game scene of a bear—classic Ulrich patterns that span from 19th-century lever guns into 20th-century bolt actions. The extensive coverage on the receiver sides, tangs, and other metal parts matches documented factory special-order or exhibition-grade Model 70s.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></p>
<p>Key Confirmation Points from Photos:</p>
<p>•<span class="Apple-converted-space">  </span>Action details: The close-up reveals the bolt-action mechanism (bolt components visible when open), consistent with the Model 70 introduced in 1936. The spherical/knobbed bolt handle and internal parts align once you account for the angle and engraving obscuring typical outlines.</p>
<p>•<span class="Apple-converted-space">  </span>“FIRE” marking: This appears on a visible internal component (common in Winchester actions for safety/position indicators).</p>
<p>•<span class="Apple-converted-space">  </span>Engraving style: Identical to Ulrich work on both early lever-actions and later Model 70s—flowing scrolls + animal vignettes (bears were popular motifs). George Ulrich (active ~1919–1949) continued the family tradition on pre-’64 Model 70s, often for special orders.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></p>
<p>Factory-engraved Model 70s are much rarer than their lever-action counterparts. Most were custom shop or special-order pieces with light-to-full scroll and game scenes. Examples include documented George Ulrich rifles with bear/deer motifs, some with gold inlays on premium Super Grade or exhibition variants.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></p>
<p>Why It Feels Unique</p>
<p>You’re right—the full-coverage style with a prominent bear panel is uncommon even among engraved Model 70s (many have lighter border scrolls or smaller floorplate scenes). This level suggests a high-grade special order, possibly influenced by earlier Ulrich patterns from the 1866/1873 era.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></p>
<p>To identify precisely:</p>
<p>•<span class="Apple-converted-space">  </span>Share the serial number (on the receiver ring, right side forward of the ejection port).</p>
<p>•<span class="Apple-converted-space">  </span>Barrel markings (caliber, “Winchester” address, proof marks).</p>
<p>•<span class="Apple-converted-space">  </span>Any engraver initials (tiny “G.U.” or similar hidden in scrolls) or factory order notations.</p>
<p>•<span class="Apple-converted-space">  </span>A Cody Firearms Museum factory letter would confirm original engraving details and cost.</p>
<p>This is a standout collector piece—pre-’64 Model 70s with documented Ulrich engraving command strong premiums at auction. More photos (left receiver side, floorplate, bolt, full stock) or the serial would let us match it to known examples. Beautiful rifle!</p>
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					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 22:10:56 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>Bo Rich on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179134</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
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					                        <description><![CDATA[<p>Louis,  I agree Martin does excellent work!  Interestingly, Martin mentions that the work may have come out of Japan.  So, it is very possible that a Service man may have ordered the work.  Been to Germany, not Japan.  So, I have no idea what the rate would of been on the dollar to the yen.</p>
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					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 22:09:36 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>Buck1967 on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179133</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
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					                        <description><![CDATA[<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">
<p><strong>Louis Luttrell said </strong><br />
For Bob...<br />
<a href="http://fega.com/memberwebpages/masterdetail.asp?recidparam=430" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://fega.com/memberwebpages/masterdetail.asp?recidparam=430</a><br />
Martin is in a TOTALLY different league than whomever scratched up that poor M70 back in the day...<br />
Just my take...<br />
Lou<br />
  </p>
</blockquote>
<p>I think it looks amazing! A lot of Winchester engraving you have to squint to see 👀 but not this one! I have never seen Martin’s work so maybe it pales in comparison but I’ve seen and own a lot of Engraved Winchester albeit 94’s and this one is pretty impressive in my humble opinion.</p>
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					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 21:59:03 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>Louis Luttrell on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179132</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
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					                        <description><![CDATA[<p>For Bob...</p>
<p><a href="http://fega.com/memberwebpages/masterdetail.asp?recidparam=430" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://fega.com/memberwebpages/masterdetail.asp?recidparam=430</a></p>
<p>Martin is in a TOTALLY different league than whomever scratched up that poor M70 back in the day...</p>
<p>Just my take...</p>
<p>Lou</p>
]]></description>
					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 21:30:32 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>martin rabeno on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179131</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
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					                        <description><![CDATA[<p>Bo  I never said I was THE engraver. I said I AM an engraver. That is why Posted my opinion on this rifle. It is just my educated opinion as an engraver. Sorry if you misunderstood me</p>
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					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 21:20:52 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>Bo Rich on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179130</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
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					                        <description><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Martin!  When did you do the work?</p>
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					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 20:51:57 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>martin rabeno on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179127</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
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					                        <description><![CDATA[<p>I beg to differ. The engraving is not Germanic in style either as Black leaf or acorn style. It is more reminiscent of the heavy handed work done in Japan on many guns after the war. I knew Claus Willig and this is not his style either in layout design or quality of cuts.  In case you are wondering why I say this, I am an engraver</p>
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					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 20:02:23 +0000</pubDate>
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                    <title>Zebulon on Can anyone identify the engraver of this 1958 Winchester Model 70</title>
                    <link>https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/can-anyone-identify-the-engraver-of-this-1958-winchester-model-70/#p179119</link>
                    <category>Winchester Rifles</category>
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					                        <description><![CDATA[<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">
<p><strong>Bo Rich said </strong><br />
I agree with Zebulon.  The thing to remember is that the dollar was strong against the German  mark.  So, a service man could of got some nice engraving at a good discount.<br />
  </p>
</blockquote>
<p>Concur, Bo. I was born too late.  By the Eighties, West Germany had become an economic powerhouse and the exchange rate flipped. The deutschmark was worth a buck twenty-five for a while I remember going over there in '83 and getting scalped.  </p>
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					                    <pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2026 16:04:18 +0000</pubDate>
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