It is not an exaggeration to say WACA has among its members the World's leading experts on Winchester arms and ammunition. 

St. Gallen, January 26.

You know with what vigor the liberal parties of

Switzerland pushed for the introduction of the Winchester rifle,

and what satisfaction the National Council’s

resolution on its introduction aroused. Like most political developments that are

initiated with an excessive outpouring of enthusiasm,

Switzerland’s new armament also seems

destined to end in a hangover.

When the shrewd American Winchester presented his

model, his sole aim was to have it thoroughly tested at someone else’s expense and

to secure official recognition of his weapon; once he had achieved this,

he withdrew his model and has now, as they say, concluded a

supply contract with Emperor Napoleon, under which he

is prohibited from working for any other state for a certain period of time. The

Federal Council is indeed having the drawings and model rifles

reproduced, but the Swiss arms manufacturers state that they will not be able to

deliver such rifles for 100,000 men from their factories for another

3–4 years, since they must first design

and manufacture the necessary machinery.

Although this concerns the large Swiss order, it took place at roughly the same time. I think Winchester wanted to back out of the deal because his new factory was running at full capacity producing the new Model 1866, and he had absolutely no way to produce the old Henry rifles for Switzerland or Bavaria. That’s why he withdrew his offer under the pretext mentioned in the article.
The Swiss ultimately opted for their own “Veterli” rifle, and the Bavarians apparently placed an order for 500 units with a local factory.

Unfortunately, I haven’t been able to find any evidence for my theory in the archives yet. So it remains unconfirmed.

Steff

The “L” beneath the crown could be the personal monogram of King Ludwig II (who built Neuschwanstein Castle).

According to the exhibit label, it is said to have been manufactured by Spangenberger & Sauer in Suhl. This company is now known as SIG Sauer and is not entirely unknown. Unfortunately, neither the Bavarian Army Museum in Ingolstadt nor the Weapons Museum in Suhl has any information on this.

Best regards from Bavaria

Steff

Bert H. said

soothsayer said

Bert H. said

soothsayer said

Bert H. said

soothsayer said

Bert H. said
Very Nice ... but how well does it shoot ?
Bert
  

got a couple of boxes of cartridges, will advise 😉
  

I have more than 4,000 rounds of loaded 22 Hornet ammo (factory new and reloads).
  

My Dad has a martini chambered in 22 hornet though i've never shot it. previous owner provided the ammo. that's a nice stockpile.
also according to Lou, the site blank is not period correct.
This is our 6th pre 64 winchester model 70 and our first prewar.
  

I have four Hornet rifles, but just one of them is a Model 70 (a Super Grade). 
It was sent directly to Lysle Kilbourn to be chambered for the K-Hornet before being delivered to its first owner.  I am currently the 3rd owner of the rifle.
I shoot and reload for all four of my Hornets on a semi-frequent basis.
Bert
  

Beautiful gun. One thing is for certain, you guys take way better photos than I.
  

The pictures were not my work... Pre-64.com sold the rifle to me and the pictures were part of their ad for it. Here is a link to the information that they still have posted on their website - An Unusually Well-documented 1946 Hornet Super Grade – pre64win.com
Bert
  

They have some nice stuff over there. i read about the redfield Jr extra hole issue there as a refresher, had heard of it prior as well. Article on the arms dealer who collected pre 64 model 70s was interesting.

Rob Kassab said
One of the biggest mysteries is the identification of the acceptance stamp:  Gothic "L" below crown.  See image.
Rob Kassab
  

According to AI - A crown over the letter "L" on a firearm most commonly indicates Germany and is frequently encountered as a military acceptance, inspection, or state/provincial contract stamp (such as Bavarian military property or component inspection markings from the pre-WWI and WWI eras).

Rare Henry Mle 1860 carbine for the Bavarian army

Message  Stanislas54000 Sat 31 Aug 2024, 15:15

Hello everyone!  I am pleased to present this beautiful and rare Henry Model 1860 lever-action rifle, produced by the New Haven Arms Company for the Kingdom of Bavaria between late 1864 and early 1865, as part of a contract for 500 rifles (only about ten of which have survived). It marks the transition to the future Winchester Model 1866 following the departure of Ben Tyler Henry. Unlike standard Henry rifles, the barrel is round, not octagonal. Furthermore, the cartridges (.44 Henry) are now loaded through a loading port, covered by a sliding ring, located at the front end of the tubular magazine. The ramrod (missing) attaches to the side of the barrel and fits into the bronze receiver. It is equipped with an adjustable rear sight and a fixed front sight. This weapon is entirely matching (456) and bears the hallmarks of the Kingdom of Bavaria.  Length = 119 cm.  It will be auctioned on Saturday, September 7th. Given the small number of known examples worldwide, I wanted to ensure that this one remains visible to all collectors of historical pieces in the vast database that is the Web.  https://www.interencheres.com/art-decoration/belle-vente-bijoux-tableaux-meubles-et-objets-dart-633948/lot-78126935.html

freebird1968 said
Is anyone conducting a survey on these rare example of the Henry?
One has surfaced for sale in France, and I have not found its serial number registered anywhere I was able to find on line.
Here is the link, the SN is 456 (out of 500).
https://www.naturabuy.fr/Tres-rare-Winchester-Henry-fabrication-Prussienne-item-11379278.html?utm_source=favsearchalert&utm_medium=email
 
It is presented as a "prussian made rifle", as these are not well known in France and the documentation available in French is somewhat limited...
  

The original link doesn't work for me....

So much information here and interesting facts we pick up from each other.

Tony

I do not agree with Houze that they were made in New Haven.  The workmanship, engineering and construction details indicate European / German manufacture.

One of the biggest mysteries is the identification of the acceptance stamp:  Gothic "L" below crown.  See image.

Rob Kassab

soothsayer said

Bert H. said

soothsayer said

Bert H. said

soothsayer said

Bert H. said
Very Nice ... but how well does it shoot ?
Bert
  

got a couple of boxes of cartridges, will advise 😉
  

I have more than 4,000 rounds of loaded 22 Hornet ammo (factory new and reloads).
  

My Dad has a martini chambered in 22 hornet though i've never shot it. previous owner provided the ammo. that's a nice stockpile.
also according to Lou, the site blank is not period correct.
This is our 6th pre 64 winchester model 70 and our first prewar.
  

I have four Hornet rifles, but just one of them is a Model 70 (a Super Grade). 
It was sent directly to Lysle Kilbourn to be chambered for the K-Hornet before being delivered to its first owner.  I am currently the 3rd owner of the rifle.
I shoot and reload for all four of my Hornets on a semi-frequent basis.
Bert
  

Beautiful gun. One thing is for certain, you guys take way better photos than I.
  

The pictures were not my work... Pre-64.com sold the rifle to me and the pictures were part of their ad for it. Here is a link to the information that they still have posted on their website - An Unusually Well-documented 1946 Hornet Super Grade – pre64win.com

Bert

Bert H. said
Hello & welcome to you Owen. 
Please consider becoming a full-fledged WACA member!  There are many great benefits that come with a WACA membership.
Bert
  

Welcome from me as well. 

I echo Bert's suggestion.  For me, the most amazing benefit is digital access to all past WACA collector magazines.  The wealth and range of information in there cannot be described.  Open any issue and you will find it impossible to at least find one article of interest.  There is much information not available anywhere else.