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I just got back from the Denver show. Lots of very nice Winchester there. Many over priced but a lot were reasonable. However, even the reasonable ones didnt seem to be selling all that well. Seems that the highest condition and rarer made the difference. There were 94s all over the show. Most in low condition but some nice ones in what I thought reasonable were prices. Im just interested in responses to what yall think things are.
Im not a dealer, but I do sell some to get others. I had several good 94s on my table and only traded one.
Thoughts?
I am by far no expert, but I shop alot and rarley buy. I have noticed that pre 64 94 without saddle ring in good+ condition can be had very reasonable. Which suprises me when I see them, but yet I walk away. To me the saddle ring is a must have, unless there are other outstanding features. However I rarley come across good or better 94 rifles Period.
August 11, 2015
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I too am not an expert, but have done a lot shopping lately and believe that the prices in general have moderated. Not sure what is the reason, but do believe that the “gun craze” of the last seven and a half years has moderated as well. I remember three or four years ago you could not touch an AR-15 for less than $1000 regardless of the make; now you can get one any day for around $600 with no frills.
When it comes to Winchesters, I see that high quality stuff still brings a premium and it may just be that the average buyer has become more sophisticated and that there are less impulse buyers as well.
I think a rising tide lifts all boats and the tide has just come full circle so to speak.
Regards,
In my perspective, this a result of a poor economy and the reduction of new Winchester collectors. I quit setting up at a
local gun show several years ago. (there are 1 million in this county) People would look at you like you from outer space with 5k Winchesters on the table. With prices where they are today, I would have a hard time just starting collecting Winchesters.
Here is another collecting observation. In 2014 and 2015 some people were paying stupid money (50k plus) for jaguar e-types and xk120s that were slam rusted-out. That stopped in 2016.
Go Figure
Walter
Which Winchester models are currently most popular among collectors and which models (if any) always seem to be on every collector’s got to have list?
Winchester Model 1873 44-40 circa 1886
Kevin,
That is up to to individual. I like Indian guns , Trappers and the ones that Won The West. Condition is nice, but as George Madis stated, Rarity is first thing I look for.
Walter
WallyB:
I think you are correct with the market has been getting soft and I think that the next generation of collectors are not willing to pay thousands of dollars for a old gun that looks like a OLD gun. I also think they will collect less guns. They will want a gun that looks new or a deluxe type gun. They will not collect multiple guns of the same model. They may collect a gun that has a documented story behind it. Most you may not agree with me, but when I show my son in his mid 30’s and his friends, they only like the refinished one’s that look new, he thinks there are great if they are matching number Colt’s or Winchester’s/Marlins, etc. Deluxe Winchester’s and factory engraved Colt’s/etc are out of their price range so they look but would not purchase at even these soft prices. My son thought I was crazy when I bought a Model 21 that was engraved by 3 Master engravers in Exhibition grade for almost $30k.
I know I have cut my collection down more than 1/2 in the last 18 months. Now I only concentrate on fancy looking or engraved guns that look almost new. I also know when I’m long gone my son will not keep all these guns. So if he needs to sell them, then they better look like something his generation wants. I quit collecting the for the most guns and only going for the ones we both like! I did the same collecting Muscle cars, nobody wanted an old looking Shelby’s, Olds 442 convertibles, 66 Nova, Mercedes 280 sl’s but was able to sell for good money if they were re-done and correct. I made some good money buying and selling Muscle cars, but that market changed also and you need to keep up with what the buyers want.
Don’t get me wrong I have some high end firearms but I doubt I will make any money on them when it comes time to sell them. To me Winchester’s are overpriced right now and needs a correction.
Randal,
That is as interesting observation on the current market. The new guys like (pretty guns) if they are original or not. I would not give up on original guns with original condition.
Walter
Randal McEvers said
WallyB:I think you are correct with the market has been getting soft and I think that the next generation of collectors are not willing to pay thousands of dollars for a old gun that looks like a OLD gun. I also think they will collect less guns. They will want a gun that looks new or a deluxe type gun. They will not collect multiple guns of the same model. They may collect a gun that has a documented story behind it. Most you may not agree with me, but when I show my son in his mid 30’s and his friends, they only like the refinished one’s that look new, he thinks there are great if they are matching number Colt’s or Winchester’s/Marlins, etc. Deluxe Winchester’s and factory engraved Colt’s/etc are out of their price range so they look but would not purchase at even these soft prices. My son thought I was crazy when I bought a Model 21 that was engraved by 3 Master engravers in Exhibition grade for almost $30k.
I know I have cut my collection down more than 1/2 in the last 18 months. Now I only concentrate on fancy looking or engraved guns that look almost new. I also know when I’m long gone my son will not keep all these guns. So if he needs to sell them, then they better look like something his generation wants. I quit collecting the for the most guns and only going for the ones we both like! I did the same collecting Muscle cars, nobody wanted an old looking Shelby’s, Olds 442 convertibles, 66 Nova, Mercedes 280 sl’s but was able to sell for good money if they were re-done and correct. I made some good money buying and selling Muscle cars, but that market changed also and you need to keep up with what the buyers want.
Don’t get me wrong I have some high end firearms but I doubt I will make any money on them when it comes time to sell them. To me Winchester’s are overpriced right now and needs a correction.
Hello Randal, you paint a bleak picture for new Winchester collectors and investors.
Winchester Model 1873 44-40 circa 1886
I think the other reason that people are not collecting Winchesters like the older collectors did is they were not brought up on the old Westerns that inspired us as kids. It’s the same that is happening in the car collecting community with old Model T’s and A’s, now its muscle cars.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
fyi I am only 31, and I’m banking on the rest of my generation to not being interested in these guns, to limit my competition in the future. my dad is a gun guy and that’s kind of where I got into them but hes not a Winchester guy So i must obtain my own. The uber high end guns are way out of my budget so I can not really comment on the current state of that market. But yeah my buddies have little interest in having a room in there house dedicated to 3 or 4 models of guns. I get all excited about a 500$ junker and they look t me like im goofy as hell.
Kevin Jones said
Hello Randal, you paint a bleak picture for new Winchester collectors and investors.
All,
I do not want this string of posts to start depicting collecting quality Winchesters as a poor investment, or a “dying hobby”. I am a passionate collector and also sell many Winchesters. Collecting Winchesters is a rock solid and enjoyable investment when done carefully. The market can change small amounts but the fact of the matter is that Winchesters are a hot commodity as they have been for decades. I also encounter a fair number of younger people collecting Winchesters.
I am 24 years old.
To all:
I am only stating what I see from the younger crowd. Patrick seems to agree for his age group. Like any collecting it has to do with disposal income and what one wants to do with it. Those in their 30’s-40’s still have to many other obligations to consider to use their money on. I am in my early 60’s and this is just my opinion on what I see coming. Others are right we grew up watching westerns on TV and the good guy always won!
What I have seen at gun shows and Auctions is the same age group as me bidding and buying these guns, I do not see the younger generations bidding thousands of dollars on a Winchester or old Colt. The generation before me is now trying to unload their collections, and they may make some money doing it because they purchased the guns at a reasonable price. I have two friends both Big time Winchester collectors, one is in his 70’s and his daughter does not want to deal with the collection after he is gone, he is now trying to sell a major part of his collection and his states it is going slow, even if he is willing to take what he has into each gun. He has lots of lookers but high dollar guns are moving slow.
But my crystal ball isn’t the tell all or I would not still be trying to upgrade on certain guns. I do it because I enjoy the hunt for the gun, not because I think I am going to make ANY money on them at the end.
I enjoy collecting but I am not as big of a collector as I once was.
I’m one of those in transition as I move toward 50 I find my disposable income increasing and my desire for collectible Winchesters growing. Unfortunately my passion started 20 or more years ago when I couldn’t afford much but I remember those prices enough to make me jealous of those of you that were in that buying generation.
Not to mention that I live in Los Angeles, where a mediocre refinished 3rd model ’73 sells for $6k or more, following you guys here and learning about what is what gets depressing. Gone are the days of the “pawn shop find” around here so I pay attention to the auctions and gun shows (I’ve purchased a couple of nice rifles from Jim Autry) but I have to say that what I’ve learned from you all has made me a much more discriminating buyer. I don’t know which is better: passing because I know better now or purchasing in ignorance and enjoying the bliss of a new toy (haha).
To collectors out there looking to downsize: remember the faithful that follow. You are our mentors.
Steve
WACA Member. CFM Member. NRA Lifer.
My observations ; old original Winchester are kinda’ like real estate, You’ll never pay too much but You may buy it a little early. Henry
W.A.C.A. life member, Marlin Collectors Assn. charter and life member, C,S.S.A. member and general gun nut.
Hi,
Just thought I would another twist to this subject. I know ( not personally) two very wealthy tobacco farmers in my area that collect mostly Winchesters and Colts. They bought collector ammo from me years ago. They never resale their guns, as they are passed on to the next generation, and next. Now they are taken off the market for who knows how long. When I asked one of them (as I had been told) if he had 3 Iron Frame Henrys, he side-steeped the question and changed the subject. I bet there are lots of farmers like this.
Cheers
Walter
I got a couple of guys close to their 80’s bringing in some decent stuff to the local shows. So I KNOW they have some nice stuff at home, and as I stated earlier i am banking on the fact that there wont be tons of competition when the times come for them to clean house. But on the other hand I have some 50′ 60’s family and friends that like them but there doesn’t seem to be a Passion for them. When I talk to new people I hardly ever run cross someone young or old the LIGHTS UP when I bring up the topic. I have got a lot of doomsday prepper types around me they have 20 ak’s and ar’s and one deer rifle. that to me is just not fun but to each there own. My mother whom is pretty diligent antique dealer collector says that a classic will always be a classic the market will continuously go up and down.
WallyB;
What does a good Driver series 3 Jag E-Type Coupe go for these days? I’d often think I would love to find any series Coupe (I don’t like Roadsters) with no engine or transmission, perhaps an Arizona car that’s covered up out in the desert somewhere. I’d drop a Chevy Crate Motor and a 400 turbo tranny in it and drive it around the U.S.A. without having to worry about it dropping dead on me out in the Boonies. What’s that you say Wally, I should dream on?
Apache (Ya Ta Hey Kola)
apache said
WallyB;What does a good Driver series 3 Jag E-Type Coupe go for these days? I’d often think I would love to find any series Coupe (I don’t like Roadsters) with no engine or transmission, perhaps an Arizona car that’s covered up out in the desert somewhere. I’d drop a Chevy Crate Motor and a 400 turbo tranny in it and drive it around the U.S.A. without having to worry about it dropping dead on me out in the Boonies. What’s that you say Wally, I should dream on?
Apache (Ya Ta Hey Kola)
<br /
You don’t need tranny, a 350 can be fitted right up . I had one done in 72 while in England.
Vince
Southern Oregon
NRA member
Fraternal Order of Eagles
“There is but one answer to be made to the dynamite bomb and that can best be made by the Winchester rifle.”
Teddy Roosevelt
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