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I have recently purchased the Chief Crazy Horse Rifle with the matching serial number Case XX Stage Knife. Unfortunately the original boxes and paper work are missing for both. Does anyone know were I might be able to purchase the boxes? Also can anyone put a value on the set with and without the boxes?
Thanks
Victor,
The Chief Crazy Horse Model 94 commemorative was issued in 1983 (for $600), with a total production of 19,999 made. The boxes were numbered to the gun, so even if you are lucky enough to find a box, it won’t match your gun. As for finding boxes, unfortunately I believe you are looking for the proverbial needle in the haystack.
In regards to the value, I honestly do not know how much your rifle & knife set is worth without the boxes.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Not sure what sort of box you need. I got a NOS (still zip tied with hang tag, leather thong in plastic bag, etc) John Wayne commemorative (also with NOS scabbard and unassembled wall plaque and 3 boxes of ammo) from a neighbor and, while the rifle in the styrofoam was perfect, the outer sleeve was pretty beat up. Someone had taped up the end to keep the sleeve from sliding off.
I still have the original, but managed to find one in much better shape on eBay. Don’t know if it is a repro or not, but in comparison the printing and finish look very close to the original if not identical.
Are you just looking for the sleeve? Or is there an outer box? Or maybe yours is different altogether? I feel like I’ve seen Crazy Horse sleeves occasionally, but that was a few years ago that I was looking.
Steve
WACA Member. CFM Member. NRA Lifer.
I have to admit I have been attracted to Commemerative at times , coincidently in that early 80’s period where I bought , 2 J/W 32-40, a Crazy Horse 38-55, (wood quality varies widely with all individual Commeratives , my CCH is amazing , altho I admit it is somewhat spoiled by the tacks and Medalian ) also nice case color , and Annie Oakley .22 (6000 made ). they have all done better than most Commemeratives , in holding their inflation adjusted prices, all bought in the $600-700 Can$ by me at that time .I also have a 67 Canadian Centennial 30-30 bought cheap without box about 15 years ago 26″ Oct barrel , great shooter !
Recent sales can be seen online with Annie Oakley and JW in the $2000 range and CCH under $1500, in unfired with good box.
The John Wayne , I wondered why Winchester would issue the gun in the wrong model , (they were only making model 94’s at this time and that is what they made all Commeratives out of , till AOK 94-22 ) and wrong cartridge , but my infatuation with 32-40 was my main motivation here.
My urge for commemeratives is long diminished, however I coulnt resist buying the Oklahoma Diamond Jubilee recently because It is the only other 32-40 issued with only 1001 being made, and I was always curious about this Issue , and never expected to see one. Rifle is unfired , nice wood , Bad cond box sleeve . I paid $2000 Can. (currently about $1400 US). Original issue (1983 )was $2400 US ,Hi premium money then for a low production issue that was expected to go up but , as many have , went down. So initially a very bad investment .
For me at this point , I dont expect any upside , only bought out of ‘nessessity for nostalga’
Since one of my JW’s was stolen , I still have an extra like new John Wayne box , sleeve , and literature , but as Bert says, since they are ser# to the gun ,would not bring premium original value , but better than no box for a JW gun without one
of course the CCH box and sleeve are much different , being different barrel length, and design, and graphics
Phil
Thanks for all your input guys, I own a few commemorative rifles they always held a allure for me. The CCH with the matching Knife is not easy find any more that’s why I jumped on it. The others I have all have their original boxes, JW,OW,WBH & LF, just figured if I can find a box with the sleeve it’s better than no box at all.
I have always wondered if I should have got a knife with my CCH, bought new by me at original issue time , at a retail store , but no mention of the knife
I think my CCH box has a cavity in styrofoam for the knife (box in storage but will check). Maybe Canadian issue was without knife ? No extra order form that I recall
With the knife being ser# to gun , it wouldn’t be an after extra order option like I got in the JW box , an order form to send for additional JW merchandise . after deliberation I sent for the scabbard , wall rack , and 2 Winchester wall clocks
I know the Crazy horse was issued in 1983, but how come it is not on the commemorative list? It is show in R.L. Wilson’s book “Winchester” with the Case Knife. Was this rifle a special issue with the matching serial numbered rifle & Knife? Does anyone know if it was available with or without the knife?
Here is the Commemorative list on this site
https://winchestercollector.org/winchester-commemoratives/
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=535953263
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=536991848
http://www.gunbroker.com/Commemorative-Guns/BI.aspx
You should be able to find more by Googling
Let us know
Phil
The Chief Crazy Horse rifle, (with a saddle ring) did not come with the knife, it could be ordered seperately but did not have a matching ser#. The gun came with the usual Winchester paper work and 2, $0.13 first day of issue Chief Crazy Horse postage stamps. If you keep an eye open you will sometimes see the knife offered seperately, I recently purchased one ,in the box for $400.00. The rifle is currently selling in the $1600.00 to $1800.00 range complete, with box ad all paper work, and with no handling marks. There is also a soft leather case and several other “Sioux” artifacts produced exclusively for this gun that were authorized by the Sioux nation that were all available and purchased seperately. Henry
W.A.C.A. life member, Marlin Collectors Assn. charter and life member, C,S.S.A. member and general gun nut.
Thanks Henry … Your reply straightens out the issue. I was looking at the CCH’s offered on Gunbroker today, and recall the first day of issue included,as shown with a couple, and started to recall the order form included offering merchandise also shown. I will have to get the box out of storage. Its been a long time since Ive looked at it.
I think the CCH was the first issued with that type of Case color , maybe the only issue ?
I was really surprised to see the large number of CCH ‘s offered at this time. It must be coincidence ? with the origional issue of 20,000 not being small, but for the number for sale right now it seems disproportionate
there were much fewer JW’s offered on GB even tho more were issued (approx 53,000)
As you note, make-up of Commemeratives were often irregular with sometimes saddle rings or carbine bands being on rifles
Phil
Hi Phil That’s quite a piece of wood on that thar Crazy Horse. I can’t say as I.ve ever seen a piece quite like that. Henry
W.A.C.A. life member, Marlin Collectors Assn. charter and life member, C,S.S.A. member and general gun nut.
Thanks Henry. I used to look at Commemerative s in the 70’s and 80’s and the wood grade varied huge from individual pieces of even the same issue from plain straight grain to fabulous
The wood assembled on take downs and special order Winchesters pre WW 1. also varied huge with luck of the draw and not even mention of special wood in the Letter
But I preferred to buy Commeratiive s from places that had selection of a few , and I had a preference for the more unusual rifle configuration offerings I also like the 32-40 and 38-55 offerings wish they had. One in 25-35
Dont like the cheap gold (plated?) carbines that gave Commeratiive s a bad name
my first Commemerative Commanche carbine was flaking the gold
but some originally more expensive issues are nice
Phil
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